Major Failings In Army Spin Outs

Major Failings In Army Spin Outs

Lots of detail came out during yesterday’s Senate Armed Services Airland Subcommittee on problems with the Army’s FCS technological “spin outs,” those items of equipment that were deemed most promising from the cancelled FCS program.

David Duma, OSD’s principal deputy director for operational testing and evaluation (OT&E), said recent limited user tests (LUT) conducted in August and September of last year and again in February, showed every bit of gear had “notable performance deficiencies.”

We’ve written before about the failed tests of the Non-Line of Sight Launch System (NLOS-LS), and Duma provided more details. During the most recent tests carried out in February, new navigation software caused six of seven total system aborts. Overall missile reliability is just 61 percent, well below the 85 percent requirement. The missile’s problems appear to be with its infrared seeker; missiles using the IR seeker hit only 5 out of 11 times during tests last year and again this year.


During the LUT in February, the first operational flight test of the NLOS-LS, only two of the Precision Attack Munition missiles hit their targets; two missiles impacted more than more than 14 kilometers from the target. The Army has identified some of the problems, including data misinterpretation by the missile’s onboard computer, motor problems and a circuit board failure. OSD recommended that the Army conduct more flight tests once the problems have been corrected.

Duma said the Class I hovering drone, the “flying beer keg,” had so many mechanical issues that the test companies and platoons kicked them all upstairs to battalion headquarters where they could be cannibalized for parts to keep at least a few operating. The Class I is supposed to be a “back-packable” small unit drone; he said an evaluation of its effectiveness cannot be made at this time because the troops didn’t even use it as intended.

The small robot, or Small Unmanned Ground Vehicle Block I (SUGV), was able to transmit still images, but only in daylight, it can’t see at night. The SUGV’s biggest problem, Duma noted, was the radio controller didn’t work at distances beyond 75 meters in and around buildings; far short of the 1,000 meter requirement. “These short tele-operation ranges exposed SUGV operators to hostile fire. Several operators were evaluated as killed during the LUT.” Also, when thrown through a window, the robot often broke.

The small cameras on remote sensors, the Tactical Unattended Ground Sensors (T-UGS), “provided no actionable intelligence to the test unit, with half of its photo images blank or blurry.”

Duma noted all of the technologies failed on reliability and the Army must fix those problems with an “extensive” redesign effort. Another LUT is scheduled for September.

Army Lt. Gen. Robert Lennox, Deputy Chief of Staff Army G-8, acknowledged that recent tests revealed that many of the FCS technological spin outs failed. But the Army feels that there’s little risk in going ahead with the development of the various items. If further development proves fruitless, Lennox said the program will be chopped. “If equipment is not ready to be put in the hands of soldiers, we won’t put it in the hands of soldiers.”

The Army is and has made improvements and modifications to the equipment, he said: “What we’re asking for is the patience to test this again.”

He said brigade commanders emphasized the overriding importance of getting the network down to smaller echelons, to mobile units and providing larger data pipes. Battlefield commanders told the Army leadership “amazing things” will happen if they can connect the digital data pipes to units on the move, he said.

Also testifying was GAO’s Michael Sullivan, who said results of the post FCS modernization efforts are “mixed,” and since development and procurement will cost the Army some $24 billion between 2011 and 2015, “it’s critical to get things right at this time.” He noted that the plan to field the new Ground Combat Vehicle within seven years is “fairly quick,” but probably doable.

A somewhat exasperated subcommittee chair Sen. Joe Lieberman asked Army officials to explain the failure of FCS and other recent modernization efforts. “We overreached,” on FCS, Lennox said. “We were counting on a series of, not miracles, but important things to happen technologically in order for that system to develop and develop on time.”

He contrasted FCS with the current GCV effort, where the Army is sticking with “mature” technologies and going with an incremental, not revolutionary, approach. Because GCV technologies are farther along, “we won’t run into as many surprises that would cause cost overruns and delays,” Lennox said.

“We’re not asking industry to go off and invent something,” with GCV components, said Lt. Gen. William Phillips, principal military deputy to the assistant secretary of the Army for acquisition. For example, the armor that will be used has already been developed.

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Good Morning Folks,

It appears for all the money that SAIC and Boeing took up front for the FCS, it appears they did pathetically little actual work on any of the individual FCS systems.

Beside showing the wisdom in canceling this wasteful program last year its time cancel the remainder of it, and ask for a full audit of how the money already spent was used.

Collect the progress reports provided to the Army and see where information was may have been falsified to mislead the Army into thinking that more progress had been made of the various FCS projects then actually was.

Are any of the former Army project managers or procurement officers now employed by Boeing, SAIC or other contractors involved with the FCS. Oooops, can’t ask that question due to a 1996 Law that prohibits the DoD from tracking the employment of former military officers after they leave the service. A Clinton era gift to defense corruption.

There is a huge difference between developing “revolutionary…technologies” and corruption with criminal intent. Senator Lieberman has a nack for not asking the right questions. The questions to General Lennox should have been why did the Army have these “great expectations”? What information provided from the contractors lead to the Army’s to believe in these “great expectations”? Was this information given to the Army as factual or just speculation?

Ah the unasked questions, Senator Lieberman has made a career off them. This just appears to be leading to sweeping under the political rug another Bush era “deal” with defense contractors.

It can’t forgotten that the Senator from Israel owes his job to Republicans who supported the “Independent Domocrat” in the general election after the Connecticut Democrats voted him out in the primary. After all it was Lieberman as the Democrats VP candidate that helped elect Bush in 2000, he didn’t have the time to campaign for the Gore/Lieberman ticket.

ALLONS,
Byron Skinner

Procurement officer is now in the program manager MRAP — $$$$$$$

Find it interesting that Greg keeps using FCS when talking about the current effort. The FCS BCT acquisition program was cancelled last June. To keep calling it FCS is not accurate but since when did Greg care about accuracy?

Notice that he never uses the program’s actual name — Brigade Combat Team Modernization — because that might detract from the sensationalistic angle that he is pushing.

Suggest that Greg ask DOT&E and ATEC for their grades from the LUT 09 test. There were 15 exit criteria that were mutually agreed upon. ATEC rated only one critieria — reliability — as being in the red. The rest were all green except for two that were yellow. DOT&E only rated 12 of the criteria. Their results were 8 green, 3 yellow, and 1 red (reliability).

So, according to DOT&E’s own ratings, the BCTM Increment 1 capabilities passed on 8 criteria, were rated “partially met” on 3, and failed on 1. Notice how DOT&E shaded their testimony — the didn’t lie outright but they sure as hell didn’t tell the Senate (or the House in March) the whole story.

Here’s the real kicker — the LUT 09 test was never intended as the last test!!!! The Army always planned on conducting another LUT this year — now, did DOT&E testify to that? Of course not — why cloud the issue with some facts? Additionally, following the LUT in September will be the IOT&E by 3rd BCT of 1st Armored Division (what, another test of these capabilities? It almost like the Army wants to be absolutely sure about this equipment before approving it for use in combat — imagine that?). Additionally, DOT&E did not testify AT ALL about the efforts the Army has made to fix the reliability and other issues identified in the LUT09 — I wonder why?

How about telling the whole story? Oh, that’s right — read Greg’s view on the program over at the sister site — Defense Tech — in which he wrote, “I covered FCS circa 2005–2007 and it was really frustrating to have Boeing and Army people go on-and-on telling you to your face how well the program was performing.”

There is plenty to be critical about on Army Modernization efforts but it is obvious from that quote that Greg’s objectivity on the topic is long gone.

Good Evening xxxxx,

Thanks xxxxx, maybe Senator Lieberman might read this. But then one would naturally be drawn to ask the question where was Congressional oversight while all this was taking place. I know at a Bruce Springsteen Concert sitting in luxury boxes paid for by lobbyist for the defense industry.

Just for the record there were more Democrats then Republicans who attended that concert.

Naw, Senator Lieberman won’t go there.

ALLONS,
Byron Skinner

ALLONS,
Byron Skinner

Yet another chapter of; “Why can’t Daddy program manage?”.

Really, they can’t get their remote camera’s to work? Some of this stuff is new and kewl and will take a little while to work the kinks out of. Hell I have built a few networks with ‘existing, tried and true’ technology and needed time to work the bugs out. But some of this stuff if kind of sad, how did it get to this point where my web camera does a better job of capturing clear photos of people moving around my house (Day and night) for $25 but the Army can’t get a working one.

new tech is new and buggy

Let the Army try and fix it.

If it still don’t work, cancel what’s broke and take what can be fixed.

At least they admit that the stuff is broke.

“The small cameras on remote sensors, the Tactical Unattended Ground Sensors (T-UGS), “provided no actionable intelligence to the test unit, with half of its photo images blank or blurry.” ”

I’m confused by this line– why would getting useless images half of the time render the good images “non-actionable”? I would think that a real time image of a pick-up truck full of taliban driving towards your base would be good information.

I agree with ArmyWonk that this article was very sensationalistic and misleading.

$24 billion for junk that does not work? Tell the suppliers to get it right, now or refund all the money! Seven years to field a new ground combat vehicle is ridiculous! Seven months is more like it. They are not inventing anything out of “whole cloth” with no background data with which to work.

LTCMike69–

You must not have much experience working with DOD related technology development programs. You’d be lucky to even get a semi-stable requirements document within your 7 month time window.

Good Morning Folks,

I seldom find myself in agreement with LTC’s, but I think LTC Mike has hit the nail squarely on the head. This is about fighting and winning wars, no enemy is going to wait till Boeing and SAIC have milked all the profits they can out of a project before it becomes operations to figure out how to defeat it.

It’s time for change, Sec’s. Gates and Lynn read what LTC Mike has to say, if it would have taken this long in WW II to field a weapons platform we would still be fighting the war. Give contractors six months from RFP to prototype and another six after contract for a tested working production model ready for operational fielding the three months to get into hands of the troops.

We are at war, and we are in a nine year stalemate in Afghanistan, by the time we can get something to the troops in the field the Taliban/al Qaeda have already figured out counter measures.

Bin Laden and Mullah Omar are still alive after nine years of being chased by the United States Army, USMC and the CIA. This is unacceptable.

This current way of getting new technology and equipment that WORKS to the brave Soldiers and Marines in Afghanistan will not WIN the conflict in Afghanistan, although it is good for return on defense contractors shareholder equity.

American defense contractors like Boeing and SAIC are the Taliban and al Qadeas best allies, in their struggle against the United States.

ALLONS,
Byron Skinner

This was all a waist of money from the start. The contractors underbid then tried to utilize cheap electronics and drives to keep the programs going. some of the electronics are nothing more than home survelence systems and RC model car controllers. If you look at a lot of this stuff it falls in the same category as the MRAP, OK for the city and paved highways but not much else. None of this stuff will work in rough terrain — heavy mud or snow. The GPS gear they are using wont even work on an overcast day. It is all junk. That Military has the people and facilities to produce a prototype on thier own for most of this gear, this would allow them to mandate what is used and cost limits, why they dont is beyond me.

Don Schenk, the first FCS PM, is now a General Dynamics employee.

OK — before some of you come at me about needing new Tech I am not dissagreeing with you at all, but it needs to be realistic and actualy usefull. There are already numerous items available to civilians that would easily fit the bill for our troops. Look at the MARINES new short wheel base jeep, They could by 100 or more POLARIS RZR’s that could perform the same function, thier even shorter and narrower profile would allow for carriying more than 2 jeeps or 1 jeep and 1 mortar trailer, and why do they have to have a 120mm mortar in a towed trailer when they could just as easily carry a 60mm and rounds on each vehicle and set up faster than a trailer mounted 120mm. There are better ways to outfit our troops than what our leaders are looking to, mostly because they have no field expieriance to relate to.

So we canned NLOS-Cannon for rockets in a box. Nice. NLOS-C had just safely fired the 5,000 round a few days before the program was cancelled — oh by the way, it worked. Way to go Army.

Sorry, old wine in new bottles is an old tactic to cover up failure. Programs begun under FCS, and rightly bear its stigma. GEN Shinseki killed follow-ons to Abrams, Bradley, Paladin, Apache, and the CEV. Industry couldn’t no-bid FCS, which became the only game in town. Shinseki silenced dissent by telling a GO conference that anyone not on board could submit his retirement papers. “Requirements based” procurement gave way to “capabilities based” procurement. Instead of figuring out what we needed, “requirements” were tailored until they matched vendor claims. That encouraged vendors to exaggerate in hopes that “requirements” would be rewritten to describe their own claimed capabilities. Every claim of “I can name that tune in 4 notes!” encouraged the next guy to claim “I can name that tune in 3 notes!” Boeing/SAIC were selected for their experience in systems management. However, nobody (read “Shinseki”) thought that their complete inexperience in building ground combat systems was a potential stumbling block. The FCS shambles will be a lesson to future force developers and combat developers in how not to do things.

Guys you cant have it both ways. One says that off the shelf stuff is cheap and unreliable, another says that off the shelf solutions already exist. This is exactly the problem, they exist, they are cheap and unreliable.

And in regards to 60mm vs 120mm. Why not give the Marines bb guns instead of M4s? You can buy about a 100 of them for the rpice of M4s, and the ammunitions is nearly free comparatively. Not to mention the weight savings.

OK Alex you are right, I did complain about what what they are trying to use to cut cost _ I guess where I dropped the ball is that there is better suited stuff out there that does the same thing dependably. Mortars are suppresive fire weapons a 60 or even an 81mm mortar will serve the same purpose while being faster to set up — operate — break down than a 120mm system and in reality the extra explosive weight is not that more noticeable in a combat situation, the extra range is the only advantage. In reality I’m glad the MARINES are going lighter and more mobile, I was not singling them out, I just know for a fact that they can replace that 500k jeep system with something a lot cheaper and better, just as all the branches can do. It’s not just the cost _ if it did what no other piece of equipment could do then it would be justified (boat — plane — tank –truck –jeep –whatever) but that is not usualy the case. Unfourtunately the Govt does the opposite wanting the high dollar shell fitted with the lowest cost internals to offset the cost of upgrades they want before the first unit is even completed.

Every effort is being made by the services to reduce the manpower to fight wars. The resultant savings in manpower is to be refocused into additional manpower-saving technology. However, there are enormous upfront R&D costs that are becoming unmanagable due to short-cuts in the proof-of-concept and demonstration programs that are also funded by the DoD (instead of by the contractors). The DoD needs to return to contractor-funded R&D to, once and for all, eliminate [not curtail or reduce] contractors bilking the government for upfront faulty technology. If that can’t be done, then keep the proven warfighters in the military UTCs and TAs: the soldier, marine, sailor, airman. If the bureaucrats are at fault, replace them with uniformed members.

i guess the conclusion 1 could make is that they are ALL thieves, taking taxpayer $$ and providing NOTHING. I bet a smaller, lesser known co. would make that system work.

I agree with Rich and Skysoldier100%. In fact I think we are all on the same wave length on this one in one way or another.

The solution rests, as Boomer suggests, in bringing all the prototyping for new applications to DoD in-house research and warfighting laboratories. And if we’ve downsized that military-specific capability over the last couple fo decades, then we need to reconstitute it ASAP. After the labs have tested every idea or potential application of existing technologies, if they work and are cost-effective, they we can contract out the production manufacturing.

But an additional consideration never made when money is free to the military generals, are the trade-offs never discussed. For example, what is the support tail to move those things into theater and sustain them? The same as just transporting a tank into theater (which we know can do the job)? We need to stop wasting time and money on “stupid stuff” like the aforementioned robot and instead buy more of the existing operational UAVs and helicopter gunships fully loaded with surveillance capabilities and weapons to do the job.

Because your webcam doesn’t get thrown off a roof, run over by a truck, burned with a blowtorch, and electrocuted as part of the testing cycle.

fair enough. My Kodak camera does though without an issue, 5m drop without an issue, 10m water again no problem. Cost ~$300. oh and it comes with bluetooth and wifi. People have made camera’s to go on whales and being shot out of a cannon, but these guys can’t come up with a camera that can take pictures on land during the day.

Oh and the test cycle for a ‘throw away’ field camera should not includes running it over with a truck, burning it with a torch and electrocuting it. It’s a camera, they are very very very very cheap. The Kodak above for example has pretty much everything you need at 10mp.

Taxpayer brings up some good points, One of them that I dont think many are aware of is that during the acquisition process there are many reviews conducted throughout the program. One of these is what is the expected life of this system how much will it cost to operate and maintain during that life span. This is where the cost of the system is to the government. for example a truck cost 50,000.00, has a lifespan of 10 years, it cost 10,000.00 a year to maintain, repair and fuel (averaging 20K miles a year). the cost to the govt for the truck is 150,000.00 each, or 15,000.00 a year for a 10 year contract each. That is why it is important that when they write articles they need to be more explicit and identify is it the unit each cost or the program ech cost for lifespan and how many years. It would make a lot more sense to a lot more people, it would also clearly identify waist and abuse which is why I think they like to keep people in the dark the way they do.

The second PM for FCS now works for Raytheon. Technology over reach is not the problem, as others pointed out the technology is out there. They have the wrong people trying to do this. A new way of buying technology needs to be doneand fade out the cold war acquistion and army bureacracy. The REF and the MRAP is the way to go.

Government Services Technology Cost is 99% administrative 0.8% Graft and 0.2% actual technology.
Before you can bid on a project you must first prove that you are top heavy enough to accomplish the paperwork.
I have more than 1,000 hours of billed DARPA time and the paperwork cost is incredible.
One problem is most grants require a PHD to apply and have at least 500 employees.
A quick google search for “RC Helicopter with webcam” shows most at $300-$400 so figure another $1000 for better range and time aloft. The Robot pictured in the article never impressed me, all of it’s incarnations looked like an easily disabled vehicle. I have seen a triangular shaped wheeled vehicle with over sized tires that would fit the bill for the intended use.http://​www​.amazon​.com/​T​h​u​n​d​e​r​-​T​u​m​b​l​e​r​-​C​a​r​-​R​e​m​o​te-…

ENough of the gripping here’s an idea
How about we get DARPA to create a grass roots county by county competition where entrants judge and vote the best entry each week for a $2000 county level grant to further the development. Each month a $5000 state level grant is chosen by the first winners statewide. Then all the state winners judge a $10,000 dollar national grant. In this repeats each week for 6 months, We would have the products and 1000s of spin off products.
Plus it would get the real genius out of the garages and actually working.
Cost of such a program would be $170 Million.
That is real stimulus with an actual ROI for all of us.

The real concern with all this equiptment failure is that the ARMY has still said it is ok for a Brigade to go to Afghanistan and test it downrange in 2012! The particular Brigade happens to be the one I am in! We are getting fielded this sorry stuff by Jan 2011 and then expected to hope like heck we don’t lose any Soldiers due to all the issues this equiptment has! I am NOT SO THRILLED!

FSC is a complete waste or money. Boeing treated like a cash cow and treated it like a “works program”. Personally, I refused to work there and left the company for greener engineering pastures. The entire program should be canceled and the Army should start anew.

I don’t blame Boeing, they’re a company bent on making a profit. The problem is that the Army gave them way too much reign and not enough oversight. Great PR, not enough engineering.

I have the solution for the Army’s acquisition woes. Since they are absolutely pathetic at systems engineering and could not develop and procure systems that would pass the slightest bit of objective scrutiny from oversight authority and independent operational test and evaluation, they should scope most of their projects to sub-ACAT 1 Level — then they can keep things within the Army and acquire systems “the Army way”. They should have ONE Major “Too Big To Fail” Army modernization project based on integrating Non-Developmental Items using existing systems/technologies. ie. FCS would have been feasible without the technological overreach.

FCS, BCTM, call it what you will. Actually, the name was changed in a lame effort to remove the stigma of the program’s failings. For something like 6 years now, all that’s been produced in terms of capabilities is the sugv, UGS (both tactical and urban — both fall into the P.O.S. category), and CL-I UAV. In terms of reliability, all the big shots at Boeing and SAIC will ever be able to say is “it’s getting better” — nobody on the program knows how to measure and quantify S/W reliability. And, oh by the way, the S/W is bloated (thanks in large part to SOSCOE), brittle and unreliable.

This is a program that should have been cancelled a long time ago — and I don’t mean renamed. The DoD should face up to reality and acknowledge that Boeing and SAIC did a crappy job managing/executing the proogram.

Some smart guys could have built better systems using some Motorola TalkAbouts, some web cams, and RC planes/helicopters. But hey, it kept a lot of people employed for quite awhile.…

As one who worked on this program, I have to express my deepest regrets. I tried to do the right things in order to get proper attention focused on some of the problems. But schedule was king, not to mention that senior management could give a horse’s patoot — some rotated out before the poop started flying, others retired and or left for health reasons.

I tried as best I could to fix things within my narrow scope of influence, but it was like sticking your finger in the dike. I can only hope that this crap gets field tested thoroughly and the DoD sees it for what it really is and tosses it in the S. can where it belongs. Hopefully, nobody will try to use this stuff in a real combat situation.

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