No JSFs Flying To Farnborough

No JSFs Flying To Farnborough

At a time when international partners are skittish about rising costs for the Joint Strike Fighter program and allies have complained about access to program information, the Pentagon has decided that not a single Joint Strike fighter will head to the Farnborough Air Show and no one from the JPO will attend the show.

We confirmed the JSF and Joint Program Office rumors late this afternoon with a Pentagon spokeswoman. Separately, we hear that the head of Pentagon acquisition, Ash Carter, may attend the show though we have been unable to confirm this. Carter’s presence would at least give the JSF partners a senior official to grill and would demonstrate that the U.S. — at least symbolically — values our allies sufficiently to send a top official to speak with them at the world’s biggest aerospace venue this year. Rumor has it that Air Force Secretary Mike Donley will attend, but that has not been confirmed.

The first time a new military aircraft appears at an air show is always a major news event and is a palpable demonstration to the world that the plane is ready to demonstrate its stuff in front of a potential audience of millions. The F-22 made its first appearance at Farnborough in 2008 and it was the talk of the show.


A congressional aide we spoke with had little to say about the effects of the JPO absence but did say that Pentagon officials are very wary in tight budget times of being accused by the general media of skylarking at an air show. Of course, for those who have worked at air shows, little about them is terribly glamorous, certainly not the workload nor the working conditions. And representatives of several large international defense companies have told me of cost-benefit analyses they have done that show air shows are incredibly productive because you don’t have to travel all over the world. Instead, the world comes to the air show and you can meet with industry and government officials from both the major producers and from the major buyers.

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Okay, I know Lockheed is trying hard to cut costs, but a spectacular performance with the F-35 would restore some confidence in the whole program.

When you have people gunning for you to fail, you tend to play it too safe.

Good Evening Folks,

First a full endorsement of absolute need by the Admirals and Generals. Then Sec. Gates telling the industry that he was concerned about their profits and now this.

If this were a movie, I think a good title would be: The Long Good by”.

ALLONS,
Byron Skinner

Fan or no fan of the JSF, it would be irresponsible and counter-productive to take an airplane which is so new to an air show. Any display it flew would be underwhelming because of its so far very limited flight envelope clearances, and thus the uneducated masses and media would unfairly dump on it from a great height.

Better to wait until the aircraft is ready to perform a handling display routine, and let it perform on its merits.

I see what your saying Magoo, but perhaps it would be worth the risk if LM was to push the flight envelope and show it handles like a F-16. Still won’t be as impressive as the F-22, but it may silence the types at APA who claim it flies like a brick.

The Russians always bring TVC-equipped Flankers of Fulcrums (which aren’t even in their air force’s inventory) to shows like this, and indeed the masses will think they are superior just because they can do some fancy airshow maneuvers with limited value in real operations.

That’s right, we should not be pushing new aircraft before proper testing occurs.…
http://​www​.secretprojects​.co​.uk/​f​o​r​u​m​/​i​n​d​e​x​.​p​h​p/t…

Still needs more testing. Smart move (and obvious choice) not to take it.

The jet to display when it is ready will be the STOVL B.

Short take off and vertical landing display.

Carter can also avoid questions concerning the tanker–which is a better reason for him to stay put than to avoid unpleasant probing of the F-35 program.

Note the artilce said the F-22 first appeared at Farnborough in 2008 — by my reckoing about 2 years after IOC — and three years after all its trouble with software stability. Then of course selling (and thus marketing) the F-22 was prohibited by law.

First Barry osbama kills the f-22 — next up –35. No wonder his chicomm buds are feeling so good. Their best friend is in the white house!

the difference there is LM has nothing to gain and Sukhoi has nothing to lose.

I’d be surprised if even Zero is that stupid.

Magoo has it right. It’s not finished the basics tests and is not ready for display. Besides, it already has plenty of foreign customer orders. The purpose of an airshow is to sell planes. JSF (F-35) is already well booked. Besides, @E_L_P is right about sending the STOVL variant when ready. That’ll be the biggest seller to foreigners.

Why spend millions for photo op for our enemies. There aren’t going to be that many customers for this plane anyway.
This isn’t going to be like the F-4,F-15, and F-16 where hundreds are sold to other countries. There’s no upside for the manufacturer, or the U.S. This makes perfect sense to me.

“where hundreds are sold to other countries”

Someone better tell the program that. Up to 700 jets for the 8 foreign JSF team partners are the wiggle-room in profit in the business plan. Then there is the hype by the program that 4,000+ aircraft will be made. I think the guy that got fired a while back even mentioned 6000 . (snort, guffaw)
http://​tinyurl​.com/​2​d​l​q​blu

“But General David Heinz, the head of the JSF program, added that “if you look at the number of aircraft to be replaced … you could easily get to 6,000.”

Sad when the guy that is supposed to be an impartial representative of the taxpayer as a DOD program manager for a major high-risk weapons procurement program–goes native.

That’s of course, “The Long Goodbye…” Raymond Chandler.

Yeah? Compare, or rather CONTRAST, the number of terrorist leaders Obama has vaporized vs doofus Bush. Then you can quack…

The F-35 is not ready for prime time is what this article indicates. The F-22A was an operational fighter in 2008 when it attended the air show. The issue of safety would be a concern for sending a version of the F-35 that
hasn’t had the software thoroughly tested. I’m sure Boeing would be more than happy to send an F-15S and an F-18F to the show to drum up business in place of any F-35 variant!

The F-35 needs to concentrate on completing its test flight program. Given the current flight status, all it would do at Farnborough is mostly collect dust on the parking apron. The flying display would consist of taking off, circling the runway, and landing quickly. Hardly the stuff of rave reviews. Send the F-35B when it is ready. Conduct a max performance short takeoff, hover in front on the crowd and do some 360s, and finish with a vertical landing. Now that would be a demo to post on YouTube.

The difference is engineering competence, thanks!

Given the Russian’s track record… no.

I wonder if the F35B will really make a good demo plane. It’s flown by software which makes it possible for pilots to spend less of their time learning to fly it and more on how to use it. That makes me wonder if it’s really possible to make it do anything exciting. e.g if you have a push-button landing system then how do make the plane “bow to the audience” since presumably the computers aren’t programmed to do anything silly and unnecessary like that?

Yes, but our track record with the JSF to date is dismal. At this point the Russians would have to work hard to be worse then the benchmark of program incompetence set by Lockmart!

That comment certainly earned you some IQ points (NOT).

A max power take off in an aircraft that’s so heavy that they needed to remove safety equipment to get the plane closer to MTOW might not be such a good idea. And conducting STOVL landings would entail paying for repairs to foreign landing pads and airfields. Maybe not such a good selling point.…

Not even remotely comperable in what is trying to be achieved either. “Program incompetence”? Maybe you could cite a comperable program somewhere else that’s been more successful? You know, a CTOL / STOVL / CV stealth aircraft?

Just throwing it out there but i live in Farnborough and there was definitely an F-35 flying overhead about 1hr ago. I am certain of this as it only had a single engine as opposed to the F-22 that was flying before it. Just saying

Andrew, Sure its wasn’t a F-16?

JF-17 and Saab Gripen NG Demo arrived today. The “f-35″ you saw was probably the JF-17.

Good comments gentlemen; just posting to track this discussion. Wished they had a way other than RSS for this.

Slightly offended that you would think i may have mistaken an F-16 for an F-35(jokes). The reason why i was saying it was an F-35 was only due to it’s shape and design, with it’s canted vertical tails similar to the F-22 and i was almost certain that it was a single engine(not to mention the different design for the thrust nozzle/s). I will admit you have all put me in a bit of doubt(usually i wouldn’t question myself)„ the only explanation i can give is that it was maybe just my viewing angle of an F-22 at the time. It’s the only similar airframe around in regards to airframe(well maybe the T-50, hahaha, like i’m gonna spot one of those things any time soon). After all it was only the one view of it i got. Truthfully, after believing it was a JSF I went back inside. Sadly the said aircraft doesn’t really interest me at the moment. Maybe it’s just a by-product of a decade of hype + combined with the fact it will be another decade of hype before my country(I’m Australian), will comfortably have them integrated into our defence force. At least by then other countries will have fielded the aircraft and we will have some real world operational figures in regards to performance(and then we will finally know if it was all worth it : )..Again sorry if i was wrong guys(and after digging around a lot on the net it seems i must be), but i want thank you @ knightone — I was wondering what the other aircraft with canard-wings was the other day. My colleagues are all British, they see a plane like that with it’s canard-wings and immediately it has to be a Eurofighter, but it was definitely not and the only other thing i thought it could be was a Rafale however it had squared intakes(maybe i should stop trying to make out parts around the engines.…hahaha„ on a plus note it was simplest way of proving to a local that the F-18 in the sky was in fact a Super Hornet and i did get a Beer out of that one =D

No problem Andrew! We all make snap judgments once and a while. One night I looked up and thought I saw a passenger jet on fire. But careful observation showed me that it had to be a three fighter formation heading west to the Rockies. I’ve never seen such a long trail of sparks coming out of a single engine jet before, but there they were! No running lights, no afterburner or obvious flame, and no sound, and this was a very clear night with no wind. The sparks were moving more rapidly near the exhaust and would slow as they receded from the aircraft, on all three fighters.

Suddenly the left wing-man broke formation and dived at the other two, seemingly barely missing them! The two right aircraft violently maneuvered to avoid collision, and the whole formation reformed as if nothing happened and changed vector towards Denver. I reported this to the FAA just for good ‘ol homeland security reasons, but really thought nothing of it, other than the weird pop-bottle rocket sparks that seemed to be trailing them for about 200(?) + meters. I couldn’t estimate their altitude, but from the speed of maneuver it looked like 5000 feet! If they were higher than that, then all bets are off on just which type of aircraft I saw.

I was accustomed to making aircraft reports in my zulu messages, when I was full time military, so I am not exactly a newbie to this.

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