New details in bin Laden raid

New details in bin Laden raid

The SEAL special operators who went in after Osama bin Laden originally planned to try to get him with a “squeeze play,” landing silently on his roof and in the yard of his compound, the AP’s Kim Dozier reports, but the frogmen had to throw that out when their helicopter crash-landed. Dozier quotes a new set of the infamous “officials” briefed on the raid in her must-read story, which is the latest to update the now-familiar narrative of Geronimo E-KIA.

Here’s how she broke it down:

Five aircraft flew from Jalalabad, Afghanistan, with three school-bus-size Chinook helicopters landing in a deserted area roughly two-thirds of the way to bin Laden’s compound in the Pakistani city of Abbottabad, two of the officials explained. Aboard two Black Hawk helicopters were 23 SEALs, an interpreter and a tracking dog named Cairo. Nineteen SEALs would enter the compound, and three of them would find bin Laden, one official said, providing the exact numbers for the first time. Aboard the Chinooks were two dozen more SEALs, as backup.


The Black Hawks were specially engineered to muffle the tail rotor and engine sound, two officials said. The added weight of the stealth technology meant cargo was calculated to the ounce, with weather factored in. The night of the mission, it was hotter than expected. The Black Hawks were to drop the SEALs and depart in less than two minutes, in hopes locals would assume they were Pakistani aircraft visiting the nearby military academy. One Black Hawk was to hover above the compound, with SEALs sliding down ropes into the open courtyard.

The second was to hover above the roof to drop SEALs there, then land more SEALs outside — plus an interpreter and the dog, who would track anyone who tried to escape and to alert SEALs to any approaching Pakistani security forces.

She continues — and this is very interesting:

If troops appeared, the plan was to hunker down in the compound, avoiding armed confrontation with the Pakistanis while officials in Washington negotiated their passage out. The two SEAL teams inside would work toward each other, in a simultaneous attack from above and below, their weapons silenced, guaranteeing surprise, one of the officials said. They would have stormed the building in a matter of minutes, as they’d done time and again in two training models of the compound.

The plan unraveled as the first helicopter tried to hover over the compound. The Black Hawk skittered around uncontrollably in the heat-thinned air, forcing the pilot to land. As he did, the tail and rotor got caught on one of the compound’s 12-foot walls. The pilot quickly buried the aircraft’s nose in the dirt to keep it from tipping over, and the SEALs clambered out into an outer courtyard. The other aircraft did not even attempt hovering, landing its SEALs outside the compound. Now, the raiders were outside, and they’d lost the element of surprise.

So Dozier’s officials make it sound as though the crashed Black Hawk not only upped the tension for American commanders because there are few things more stressful than a helicopter crash, it required the teams to throw out their initial plans for assaulting the compound. And it changes the narrative that the SEALs fast-roped from the other Black Hawk inside the compound — Dozier has the second bird touching down outside and its guys getting out there.

What happened next, in Dozier’s account, jibes with the story that has already passed into American lore: The SEALs spotted bin Laden on a balcony and then chased him into his bedroom, where his story ends. But in her account, this took place only about 15 minutes after the team’s arrival. The senior defense official who briefed reporters on this at the Pentagon on the day after it happened — I was there — said the SEALs killed bin Laden “toward the end” of their 40 minutes on the ground. At this point it’s not surprising that there have been differing accounts, and we may never know the real story until the inevitable Mark Bowden bestseller, or if the feds just end up releasing the after action reports on this operation.

Another interesting aspect of Dozier’s story is her three MH-47 Chinooks holding somewhere in the distance, carrying dozens of special operators in reserve. It’d be interesting to know whether American officials planned to bring them in if Pakistani soldiers responded to bin Laden’s compound, to reinforce the smaller team that was already there, or whether they would’ve bugged out immediately if things went bad. As it stands, it sounds like at least one of these helos was brought in to exfiltrate bin Laden’s body and the intelligence the SEALs liberated from the compound.

In Dozier’s version of events, bin Laden had two weapons nearby: A Kalashnikov rifle and a pistol, although they were apparently too far away from him to reach. The SEALs took them with them as part of their intelligence cache, she writes. The story still isn’t totally complete, however: Dozier writes that the SEALs flew from bin Laden’s compound to Bagram Air Base, from which bin Laden’s body was flown to the aircraft carrier USS Carl Vinson for its burial at sea. So does that mean a Navy C-2 Greyhound cargo plane also figures into this story? Earlier accounts had made it sound as though the body had been flown directly to the ship. If so, we’ve yet to hear the story of the C-2 crew who flew bin Laden to his watery grave, or even to learn which squadron it was.

(The plane may have belonged to a detachment of VRC-40, “the Rawhides,” which deployed aboard the Carl Vinson as part of Carrier Air Wing 17.)

The crew may not even have known what was being loaded into the bird — at that point, bin Laden was just that much more cargo.

Join the Conversation

“…three school-bus-size Chinook helicopters…” Please tell me that this is from the AP has been bought out by the Onion, and is not from a serious news source.

Yeah,come on now. Most of us ARE smarter than a fifth grader.

These are “secret” Chinooks. The media is never wrong. ;-)

I’m wondering who leaked the dog’s name.…

Possibly 10 yrs from now when this is semi declassified you may be able to watch it on untold stories of the NAVY SEALS but it still wont be 100%. they are never gonna give all the details because that would work against them in future ops — not even the CoC is privy to this info, its all in house, always has and will be, that is what gives them the edge to get it done.

The reality is that the operation was a screw-up. Luckily they only had to kill an old man and his wife.

Stuff happens buddy, the only part of this mission that was a screw up was losing the chopper. They recovered beautifully. No one who didn’t have it coming anyway was killed, sounds like a pretty successful mission to me.…

Really !!!!! What is your experience with operations of this type of operation — non probably. And what were you doing Sunday night as you were drinking your coke or snoring away

The first rule of ops is that if something can go wrong it will, and when it does what will be the professional response. Seems to me things went pretty darn well considering what they had to deal with. Objective dispatched — no loss of life.

The only misjudged aspect was the hover ability of the helo and as any of the service pilots will tell you it is tricky in high altitude, heat and at gross plus weight. That my friend is a design error when the original RFP was issued for the bird and engineers who did the “do over” didn’t take into account. Adding 1000 lbs to net weight is questionable. In plain words — stuff happens.….……

Ah yes the culture if defeat and failure that makes our military what it is today.

But I understand the need to hype up the mission and declare everyone heros after 10 years of Osamas taunting. But the reality is that the mission kicked off with trying to rescue a crashed chopper and it took half an hour to get to Osama with resistance consisting of little more than a driver with an AK.

Osama was obviously not expecting a visit without a call from the ISI but if he had taken even the simplest of precautions to defend himself we’d be negotiating right now with the Pakistanis to get back our dead seals.

Did you even read this article comrade Oblatski? It took about 15 minutes. Some 45 SEALs could have easily held off a company of Pakistani troops, or dealt with whatever security Osama may have had.

Oblat, you’re nothing but a troll. No one here takes you seriously. I doubt anyone anywhere has ever taken you seriously about anything.

Already out of date — check the latest story.

Just, justice is assasination is Barack Obama’s Justice. No court is true Justice, Barack Obama.
American Justice, do you know? Is it Ok?

No defence, Osama bin Laden’s, live site. offencive tactics, is it easy? US, constitution for US military’s tactics.

Get back to us when you have collected enough balls to post under your own name.

I need auto correct or spel check.

In the heat of battle some helocopter pilots have a tendency to come in “Hot & Heavy”, during the grenada invasion at least two blackhawk pilots went in “Hot &Heavy stacking up at least three birds killing several Rangers and pilots. You still have to give those pilots alot of credit they are under immense preasure to give the spec-ops the best opportunity for a suprise attack, every second counts. For those who posted anything negative about this mission , they better use their time on the net to do alot more homework about such matters,because they sound to me as if they do not know what they are talking about. They also need to grow up , sounds to me like some young person who does not have alot of life lessons under their belt

You know, it is okay sometimes NOT to comment.…A win is a win.

So lets summarize in the culture of mediocrity and failure:

1) if you are put under a lot of pressure and fail then you should be given a lot of credit.
2) performance doesn’t matter if you luck into it then that is what counts
3) your always going to fail as failure is normal

Homer Simpson would be proud.

This is one reason why it would had been best if they had only said they had confirmed intel reports that bin laden died while reading boy porn on a toilet in pakistan and left it at that. Look at the historical facts — SEALS are the best, each mission is trained under various scenarios due to the fact that you cant predict a perfect battle. There training paid off once again. Also it is very well known that Osama never traveled anywhere with less than a dozen body guards. There have been multiple accounts of this mission and body count, as I said earlier — nobody other than those on the ground will ever the the whole story and only a portion of it will ever be told to the public.

No platoon of body guards according to the pentagon reports just a driver. I guess we will just have to wait for the Hollywood movie to come out to correct the historical record. I know the seals are counting on it.

How hard is it to capture an old man defend by his wife ? Too hard obviously.

Seems like a pretty common helicopter piloting error, although I was not there, etc. I.e., something that should have been anticipated. Maybe just a great pilot but in a relatively unfamiliar aircraft … Despite the “stealth” characteristics of the helicopter, I can’t imagine why the planners thought the folks in that house wouldn’t immediately know something was happening right over their heads. It does seem surprising that the house wasn’t rigged with explosives and, if it was, they weren’t used, especially given the delay in getting from the ground to the third floor.

As for all this jingoistic talk about the SEALs being the best … well sure, they’re very qualified, we’re rightfully proud of them, they are some of our very finest, but so are the men of the many other special forces around the world, who do just as well but with far less funding and chest thumping.

As I recall, the SEALs have nothing to be proud of with the 100% negative (and shameful) outcome of Operation Red Wings, and didn’t they just blow up an Australian journalist they were trying to save?

Probably the most damning criticism of the otherwise outrageously successful UBL operation is the lack of security and discretion at the highest echelons.

- Osama is dead and in a coffin under the sea.
– His electronic files are now in our hands..
– The SEALs and Night Stalkers suffered zero casualties.
– The crashed chopper was demolished with the exception of the tail, which Pakistan is sending back to us. (probably at the threat of not getting their yearly billion dollars)

So what’s your problem again? Or do you think you done a better job of rapidly landing a heavily modified Black Hawk in “hot and high” conditions.

True there are a lot of good SPECWAR units around the world, but very few of them are trained to operate in every enviroment of the world which gives the TEAMS a well desrved place among them. SEALS dont beat their chest and tell stories in bars, in reality you wont find SEALS even talking about what they do or have done, let alone wearing TRIDENT emblazoned clothing. Walter Middy’s and wannabe’s do enough of that. I also think you were refering to REDCELL and not REDWING, WHile Marcinco brought a lot of shame on the TEAMS — Lutrell and his 3 buddies who died did nothing shameful or negative. In fact by not killing the sheppard boy who stumbled upon the 4 man team (who ran and reported them) knowing it could lead to a world of hurt for them (which it was, highly outnumbered and gunned) was pretty darn admirable. If they had killed the boy to maintain their hide and it latter came out, I guarantee there would had been a lot more negativity thrown at the TEAMS by the press and liberals demanding investigations and such.

Any fool can crash a chopper Bill, I allow even you would be able to.

It’s important to realize that for every screwed up mission that results in medal of honors all round, there are many ordinary missions where nothing goes wrong no contact is made and everyone returns home safely. That is the unreported story.

Yeah have 2 MH-XX stealthed up as far as you can go , and three or more MH60 making more noise than a heard of elephants behind them, anouncing that they are there.
Makes no frickin‘ sense !!
IMHO they used MV22 Osprey‘s as they are quieter and have a smaller audible foot print than a Chinook.
The chinooks wre there as a “just in case” option

MH-47 rather than MH60‘s sorry for the confusion there guys

I personally don’t believe any of this information regardless who decides to publish it is not anyones business but the military. Remember the old saying “Loose lips sink ships” The press and some of the insiders have too much information for there own gain.

You fools. Usama Bin Laden was dead in 2001. This was a Psy-OP.

Steve Pieczenik, MD, PhD, former deputy assistant secretary of state under Henry Kissinger, Cyrus Vance and James Baker, with expertise in foreign policy, international crisis management and psychological warfare, serving presidential administrations of Gerald Ford, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush in the capacity of deputy secretary:
http://​www​.youtube​.com/​w​a​t​c​h​?​v​=​D​R​z​Y​5​t​K​s​Zik

http://​www​.youtube​.com/​w​a​t​c​h​?​v​=​w​u​Y​E​6​3​A​F​uqg

We are we even having this discussion? The United sates is the only nation that likes to share with everyone what we did and how we did it, putting future operations at risk. Why did our leaders feel they had to tell everyone about the computers and other items we seized? Other terrorists now knew to quickly move their location and sever communications. We should take lessons from the Mossad, they have been at war much longer than us. When they do an operation, they don’t share it with the world. They especially would feel no obligation to discuss how a body was disposed of, or even if their was a body…

take a lesson from the Mossad ! what a novel idea.Their enemies KNOW they may hurt them but will be paid back in spades​.It may take ten years (after Munich Olympics) but it will happen.And best of all,the Israelis don’t give a hoot what ANYBODY cares,including their #1 benefactor and protector The USA. God Bless them !

As long as the end results are,
1. Osama bin laden dead.
2. No American casualties.
I am thrilled to have such men serving my country and give a big OORAHaaa out to the boys, Navy SEALs Good to Go.

This is the culture of mediocrity in a nutshell.

Looks pretty much that everyone is agreed — we are so frustrated by bin Laden’s taunting for the last decade we will settle for any sort of botched mission. A culture of mediocrity that is no surprise really.

A lot has changed over the last 10 years, I think we are more than willing now to settle for less just to get by. And admittedly lot less for many of you is coming down the pike.

I think the WRITER needs a few lessons.
Frogmen are in the water, and were not used.
SEALS went in which are way above a frogman.….….….….….….

What a shame .….….….….….…
The other thing is the CH-47 never should have been used, they are loud, and with the side as a boxcar.….….…

The Black Hawk has now proven that they crash on missions, and the Army cannot fly them, but into the ground.….….….….….….….….….….….….….….….…Black Hawk Down and now this.….….….

More proof that nobody in DC knows how to keep their mouth shut.

‎“Coming up at 11, the names and home addresses of everyone in SEAL Team Six.”

And, it sure is fun reading all the AAR comments and critiques of the 160th SOAR pilots’ flying skills, from dudes eating Cheez Doodles while sitting behind their keyboards in their air-conditioned homes.

Bottom line mission completed… Now what abut the Mexican Drug Lords. Can we not do the same to protect our boarders? Mr President let’s get this done as well. Congress I am calling for your action as well.
God Bless the USA and our right to be Americans.

I’m with John,etc.…a win is a win. OBL was an evil, evil man.

Wow.…. I’d bet my life none of you ever spent a day in the military, never mind in special opns. To comment that the Blackhawk crash was the result of ‘a common pilot error’ indicates a true lack of understanding of helicopter performance and the mission at hand. If it’s so easy, YOU dedicate your life to a year of pilot training and then several years of operational experience BEFORE you get a chance to strap an aircraft on to show what you have to offer. You are an ingnorant ass.…. Blackhawk down? Are you serious? Botched mission? OK hero — let’s see you do better.

To those that feel a Chinook is innapropriate for special opns, you too, have no understanding of the aircraft or its mission capabilities. It is the fastest of any current US Army helicopter — and most capable of the cargo/utility class of helicopter in the world.

All of you armchair warriors need to shut the F up

The quality of your posts seem to indicate a culture of failure from wherever you’re from.

Don’t even try to second guess the miltary . They were there we were not. Remember the Twin Towers, those who worked there were never even given a warning. So why give OBL a warning? He needed to fo
go.

Personally, I’am not insterested in other details about this, as far as I’am concerned, it’s closed.

Seal team six? hell, I thought it was seal team one million.…..HEEEEEEEEhehehehehe!!!!!

sounds like if all of are sitting in a bar what’s next religion GOD BLESS USA! AND SEALANT

Sounds like you spend most of your time sitting in front of the TV. What’s next.…Oprah, Idol, Dancing with the Stars? Yeah, for me.…God Bless the USA and the Military comes to mind. Then, again. I’ve been outside and needed to say or hear a prayer or two.

that’s GOD BLESS SEALS AND GUYS WILLING TO TRY

I agree 100% they did a great Job, when problems arised they improvise, and like you said they got it done.

The news media tends to leak or give out too many facts BEFORE, and after the operations against our enemy.
Example: tracking Bin Ladan via his cell phone / collecting helpful intel and documents on this last raid. These jerks just blab everything to our enemy without thinking that what the journalists say or print could help the enemy and lengthen the war!!! (dumb gossipers without common sense )!!!
Even this last story in the paper about a secret training camp should have been kept quiet. But no, the news media even showed the camp layout.….…IDIOTS!!!
The only news people over in the war area should be combat photographers!!!!! .….…..Instead, our soldiers have to stop and think ‘what is politically correct’ before they take action. Seconds can mean life or death for our troops!!! (A Viet Nam Vet) .…..GOD BLESS AND PROTECT OUR SOLDIERS!!!

Stealth…welcome back brother! We (VN Vets) can smile and be thankful for the reception the ‘kids’ are getting when they return from overseas. If you were a ground pounder, ‘Don’t mean nuthin’.…still is apropos. Let the news flunkies spout off and let the military do its job. We always found a way.

The latest reports are that the mission was not to kill but to capture bin laden so it wasn’t achieved. If they had wanted to kill him they could have just bombed the place.

The plan to make a simultaneous landing by two specially silenced blackhawks an capture him to use the element of surprise.

But it didn’t get off to a good start when they loudly crashed one of them on the front lawn. So they could no longer risk landing on the building roof and had to make their way up the 3 stories a process which took 15 minutes.

Like I said if bin Laden hadn’t been a sick old man who had any bodyguards or had made even the most basic of defensive precautions we’d be negotiating with the Pakistanis right now for our dead seals back.

The famous picture of the whitehouse staff look on in horror at the overhead video of a downed backhawk smoking on bin ladens garden can no be understood. A major opportunity to interrogate the Al Queada mastermind was lost because of the botched mission.

Ospreys suck, then instead of a downed bird you’d have a downed bird with everyone inside killed.

What is the ‘culture of mediocrity’? My comment or those that watch TV and pretend to understand covert missions?

So ends the most expensive manhunt in history. Just wonder how many ways they will have to split the $50 million. Do they have to pay for the helicopter they wrecked? What about spousal support for the rest of his wives?

SERIOUSLY we need to stop being Pakistan’s b!tch– we have pumped over $50 BILLION into that craphole just to keep them from starting a nuclear war with India over Kashmir. We should have invaded Islamibad instead of Baghdad it would have been more effective and cheaper. (written from a Combat Outpost in Afghanistan)

I think you need a few lessons too, like keep your pee sucker closed when you don’t even know what you’re talking about. I mean really, have you ever been in the military? Or even the Boy Scouts?

Sure, it is nice to have Osama Bin Laden (OBL) dead, can’t complain much about that. BUT, to me, this highly praised operation was a colossal failure. A colossal failure in judgement by the one issuing the mission orders. I am assuming that the SEALS essentially did what they were told to do.
We’ve all been told over and over that OBL was the leader of al qaeda, so let’s assume that his role in al qaeda was prominent (I personally doubt that he was doing much leading from this hovel without communications or a visible support staff, but that is another issue). However, It is beyond comprehension to me that you could have SEAL team, armed to the teeth, in the room, with an alive and unarmed OBL, without any means of offering meaningful resistance, and you would not CAPTURE him. Capture him and take him away for interrogation. Does Al Qaeda have nukes?, Where are they? Sleeper cells in the US or Europe? Who/Where? Leaders? Communications, Locations? Financing?, Bases?, Plans?, etc. That information, if he possessed it, would be priceless. It could possibly have saved countless lives. It is not believable that CAPTURE would not have been the highest priority (and kill, only if impossible to capture). Or, stated differently, it is unbelievable that such a high risk operation would be ordered simply to kill him. Sure, there would be potential ramifications, security concerns, expenses, etc. associated with having OBL in custody, but that could be managed.
SEAL teams aren’t stupid; they have to had been aware of the intel treasure that was within their grasp. To me, it makes no sense to do what we have seemed to have done. but, if you use your imagination, there are other possibilities. I doubt that any of them transpired.

ENUFF said about the raid to get bin Laden!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

On the plus side they did manage to capture the drivers porn collection.

The mission was to capture — the plan was to capture. They screwed it up.

Now I understand that in large parts of America screwing up the main objective is perfectly ok and even expected. But you would have thought that e would send our best.

Perhaps we should have asked to SAS to do the job.

Was this message encrypted if not seek professional help. END TRANSMISSION

23 years as an aviator shithead

see message below

Uh, I wasn’t replying to you, I was replying to the original post from didogdouche. If you look at your response to me you’ll see that is is indented from mine, my post is only indented from the original. At least I know someone has read mine now, though.

By the way, I couldn’t agree more with your post… the first one.

23 years as an aviator asshat.…you?

RE: Comments by OBLAT__I can understand the ‘immense’ pressure Oblat is under. How else can he account for the errors he has with spelling, grammar, syntax? Y’know, for a guy who believes that the Seal OBL mission was a failure, Oblat’s life must be under a great deal of stress. I can envision this know-nothing as a gate guard at a girls’ boarding school…I am certain he has the medals to prove his valor.
Examples from the posts of the ‘perfect’ Oblat:
1) ‘your always going to fail as failure is normal’ (try: YOU ARE)
2) ‘The plan to make a simultaneous landing by two specially silenced blackhawks an capture him to use the element of surprise. (try: AND)
3) The famous picture …of a downed backhawk smoking on bin ladens garden can no be understood. A major opportunity to interrogate the Al Queada …mission. (Try.…well darn! Just rewrite both sentences and check for, y’know, spelling, grammar, etc.).
A major opportunity to present your botched ideology was lost due to your inability to state your PERFECT position. You ARE the prime example of mediocrity and failure.

Bill,
You must consider the source of the information young people operate on. The liberal and ultra liberal society drop-outs that make up a majority of teachers at every level of our society. Ever since the Vietnam War teachers deferment rule, it has gone from a venerable job populated by folks with a desire to teach truth, to a left wing only cadre of propagandists seeking to better the world (and their pay scale) through demonetization of everything American. Corporate America, God, Sports, Morality, Marriage, Freedom, Privacy, Self-Governance. Its no wonder the first thing a kid looks for in the morning is his Xbox 360 controller, a mountain dew and the TV remote. Escapism is the only thing left after all the ugly years of brainwashing. If I had to go through that I would be angry, disaffected and uninformed.

Amazing how many don’t understand this is just the beginning of more to come. Also, the erroneous statement that there are no “perfect operations” indicates a lack of knowledge on the subject as perfect operations take place every day without you knowing and no press! In addition to being necessary, this op was a press event and could not have been secret for this reason.

I stand by my comment that there are no ‘perfect operations’. I am uncertain where you receive your information but I am certain that every operation has a glitch. Again, the reason that training is continuous is to revisit prior field activity and learn from mistakes (big or small). Do not confuse a ‘successful’ operation with a ‘perfect’ operation. If your vision is that the in-field operation is the only facet of covert ops, you are sadly mistaken.

many of us agree with you, but at the same time a bigger issue resides within our borders. There are over 1 mil street/prison gang members right under our feet that would become a major issue if we impact their supply chains. Cartel recruters have already been busted by undercover cops trying to unite the gangs. it is a concern and nobody has an answer how to keep it from exploding in our faces without actualy conducting covert hunter killer ops against the gangs in the US with the military on standby to move in and assist when they start reacting — needless to say DC is not in favor of such a thing, so we are stuck in a rut while some states try to make an impact on their own despite interferance from DC.

mea-cupa Boo

It’s called war so why is the United States the only country that is worried if there are some non-military killed. When Osama sent his crew into the twin towers they were looking to kill non-military and as many as they could. My guess is that we (The United States) are still sending the same millions of dollars into Pakistani who protected Osama for so long. Why don’t we cut them off and use that money to patch up some things here at home? This whole thing is up side down!!

You’re assuming, of course, that everything that’s been “leaked” is true. One would hope that some of the “leaked” information is disinformation (a word some of the blowhard jingoists on this blog might need to look up). Who says UBL isn’t still in Bagram or aboard the Vinson or wherever?

Nope…out-of-work Special Intelligence Ops (I know oxymoron!) field operative.…long time ago.

Your the fool JW. It’s easy to see that your email is written knowing nothing about the Military or Politics.

You need to get punched in the face. If you’re going to post something, at least make it sensible, spelling can take a back seat for you.

Usually get my secretary to correct the typos but hey you sound like just the type to make a good secretary maybe I should send all my stuff to you.

Got to love the could-have-beens

I doubt that you have either the finances to employ a secretary or the intellectual ability to run a company. At best you may be a sophomore in high school. At worst, you may just be plain ignorant. Either way, one does not have a secretary/administrative assistant read and enter posts.…in other words, your posting is pure BS. Another example of your mediocrity and failure.

Much better than the ‘never weres’ and ‘never will bes’…like you. Have you had the ‘L’ taken off of your forehead or are you still proud to be a complete LOSER?

You got that right! I love reading critiques of a mission by people that have never even trained for a mission like this. Fog of War? “No plan of attack survives contact with the enemy” ever hear of that stuff?

I was never a SEAL. I don’t claim to even be able to critique them. Just 10th Mountain Lightfighter who got his knees busted up.

Personally, I live in the DC area. I would like the Police to get off their fat behinds and start arresting the MS13 gang members. I now carry when I go to NOVA because of those bastards.

Yeah, you and one other poster(imposter) here always say that; but really — who are you?

If OBL was killed in 2001, then there would have been a big deal made about it then like it is now! the same as with Sadom Hessein, there was a big deal mad out of his and his sons deaths, so John Washington, keep on listening to the made up stories on YOUTUBE!!! and I aggree that the only ppl who needed to know the story in its entirety are the Military and DOD! I guess some ppl don’t know the meaning of OPSEC even post operations! Loose lips Sink big ships!

Frankly, it is funny reading your offal, I mean, seriously, have you ever been a soldier of any sort? Your diction makes me think you may be from a former Soviet Union country… If so, then let me pose a question for you, 20,000,000 Russians killed in WWII to kill only 2,000,000 Nazi’s. Explain that will you (Oh, and on the statistics, about 560,000 Americans killed killing about 4 million Nazi’s and about 2,000,000 Japanese soldiers).

If you are not from one of the former Soviet Union nations, please disregard the above example.

Thank God for these experts. After two wars–one wearing crossed rifles and the other the mill rinde of the Navy JAG Corps–I thought the Army air crews and the SEALs did a pretty damn good job. Some untoward stuff happened as it tends to in combat, our guys adjusted, completed the mission with no friendly casualties, and came home. As I translate what our grammatically challenged colleagues are saying, I’m wrong. The mission wasn’t perfectly done, it was too easy, we used the wrong equipment, and Army pilots can’t fly. As the son of an Army aviator (33 missions in B-17s bombing the Germans, reported KIA in Korea fighting on the ground in command of a triple A battery, and command of a helo battalion in Vietnam), those are killing words. After a micro-second of reflection I think you guys are wrong, uninformed, and probably more than a little jealous. I doubt that you people are beating the girls off with sticks either unlike the SEALs, pilots, the other guys drawing flight pay, and the canine special warrior.

Dont blame you a bit, I do the same myself here in TX. A lot of folks turn a blind eye to all the kids and young adults hanging out at the malls and parks and wearing bullet proof vest thinking it’s just a fashion stement. Nobody wants to admit that we have raised a bunch of worthless and violent youths in our own country while worrying more about taking care of people in other countries.

OBL’s death couldn’t be kept a secret for numerous reasons .. mostly political. So why wouldn’t one expect a great interest in learning how he died? There have been too many variations of the story told. I’d like to know exactly what happened to get history correct.

Of course we could make an operational secrecy argument. But what secrets were really revealed? We already know special forces go into hostile places at night in helicopters. We know they can blast their way through doors and walls. We know they are trained to act quickly using diversionary tactics keeping the opposition off guard.

What was revealed was the existence of stealthy helicopters. But, that secret was lost when one crashed. Diplomatic difficulties quickly followed .. we couldn’t deny we were there! Perhaps an ability to send real time video back to Washington was a surprise. That didn’t surprise me because unmanned drones routinely can do that.

It’s nice to not talk about these special operations so as to create a mystique surrounding them. But this story will not go untold.

Actualy FROGMAN has pretty much always been used to describe both UDT and SEALS because frogs are amphibians just as they are unlike DIVERS who only work in the water. A lot of the guys in the TEAMS, especialy older ones still refer to themselves as FROGMEN or SPECWAR most of the time rather than SEAL. Also the 47 is very fast for a chopper and the pakis use them as well which is why they would not had drawn much attention in that area being next to a base.

You gotta love how the little people think the leaders of industry think just like them. It’s just so quaint.
Unless you’re a gardener or pool attendant I’m sure we don’t mix in the same circles. Not that I ruling it out — just that I know a lot of other servicemen end up like that.

Perhaps your insistence that every snatch operation starts with a crash and finishes up killing the target — cut short your career ?

How do you feel about hostage rescues — do they always result in the death of all the hostages ? or undercover surveillance missions — do you hand out business cards to all the locals ?

Are you completely sure you weren’t in the Special Clown Team ?

Oblat, don’t put yourself down for being a gardener/pool attendant! Once you have your GED, I am sure your supervisor will let you turn on the pool pump or weed the garden all by yourself.
’Not that I ruling it out…’.…You had better work on your reading and writing skills; you will never advance beyond unskilled laborer if you can’t read and write. You are absolutely correct that we would never travel in the same business circles. I have tremendous respect for anyone who works for a living; from Janitor to CEO, my hats off to them all. Your view about veterans is misguided. Check the rosters of corporate CEOs, CFOs, COOs and you fill find a preponderance of veterans in virtually all corporations. You will also find well-educated hands-on managers who have both the educational acumen and leadership qualities sought by successful companies. It is obvious you possess none of these qualities.

Special-school-bus-size maybe.

Sure improves on our failed rescue attempt during the Tehran American Embassy crisis. Proves again that highly trained, specialized teams do better than an inter-service PR expedition.

‘Special Clown Team’??? Now that’s funny! I wasn’t aware that hostage rescues ‘always result in the death of all the hostages’…but I am sure you know EVERYTHING about covert operations. Why shucks! I’ll bet you were on EVERY mission ever conducted by our covert forces. I’ll be you watch all those TV shows and go to all those movies that show how our field operators conduct themselves. Shoot! I’ll bet you probably have your own Rambo knife and headband and can shoot any weapon ever produced. I am sure you are a boy to be feared! Gosh! You must be a true leader. I am in awe of your capabilities. Your mastery of the English language, your executive position in the Corporate World, and your complete understanding of military operations humbles me. Did your remedial reading class just get out? I guess it is time for you to go home and let Mommy make you dinner. Don’t stay up too late! Special Clown Team.…bwa-ha-ha-ha! Now that is still funny.

TL:DR

You posted TL:DR, don’t you mean TL:CR (can’t read)? I didn’t count the words, but I figure around 150 in total. I didn’t realize that this was too great a task for you to accomplish! Or is Mommy making you wash the dishes ? I am sure she told you to study after you finish the dishes. You must be an embarrasment to you parents! Special Clown Team!!!! Priceless!

Only video of Bin Laden with him holding up the local newspaper to show the date, and a dialysis machine behind him will convince some people he was there and alive.

Only video of his body and the captain of the US ship holding up the local newspaper to show the date, and the ship’s emblem behind him will convince others Bin Laden was there and dead.

I’m DAMN Proud of our SEALS! I wish we knew who they were so we could properly honor them. They are the best and I am real happy they are on our side! And the guy above is right, all our military all over the world IS THE BEST! God Bless all of them!

I know nothing about the aerodynamics of these special forces helicopters, but I do know that airfoils loose their ability to lift in thin air found at high altitude or hot regions. I suppose rotors tend to mess up in sandy environments, though it’s surprising how well modern jet engines do when they are subjected to sand inhalation tests.

I recall a hostage rescue-by-helicopter failure in Iran, and Jimmy Carter took the blame. I understand that this mission to Pakistan had extra special forces as backup, but if your transportation equipment fails, you’re screwed. Is there no helicopter that is audibly quiet and can take harsh conditions?

If not, we really need one now, since our politicians seem to continually get us into oil wars, and I don’t see that changing for years to come.

You got that right. No details of the riad should have been given to the media. But BHO needed to up his ratings, So I guess this is why he used I and Me so many times in his address to the nation. I only want to know was he on the first or second chopper. And what was his weapon? A golf club? This administration make me sick. 101ASHAUVALLEY 68–68

Welcome back Brother! The Screamin’ Es from Camp Eagle kicked ass throughout Quang Tri. The Valley was a b***h! Hue was great for the Steam & Creams and the Rock Pile (Alpha 4/Con Thien) was a hell-hole. Hope you still have and wear your CIB with pride! VN 69–72

Why would anyone in power even mention SEAL 6?
I’m a civilian and I want our military to be effective, and keep its capabilities and methods secret.

Isn’t there some law against telling state secrets?
Oh, I forgot; The president is above the law.

TOOOOOOO much information. Let sleeping seals lie for another occasion(No pun intended). These Tactics are too sensitive for fure missions. Adm. Mullen is correct To much is being released.

A Chinook is actually about the size of a school bus

“Earlier accounts had made it sound as though the body had been flown directly to the ship.”

I don’t understand the obsession for exact minute detail, especially this soon after the event.

If I remember correctly…about 52′ long with a 16′ fuselage (about 12′ wide on the inside/troop-cargo area) and noisy as hell on the inside when travelling. CArries about 40–45 troops with their carry-on equipment. Fun to ride and even more fun to jump out of!

The reality is that you are a jerk.….….seriously! Been to the local mosque today, have we|????

Pretty amazing…all these armchair special operators. You can bet that the “real deals” have better ways to spend their time — thank God! BTW, how many of you failed third grade English? From the posts, most of you couldn’t have gotten a job as a janitor, much less someone in the Pentagon directing Special Operaions. Go back to the TV/action videos, etc.

Seem to remember it was the last admin.that loved leaking info, putting our men and women in harms way.
Sounds like you are just pissed because OBAMA did what Bush couldn’t.

There are still a lot of unanswered questions like:

Why after Osama was spotted at the end of the hall by 3 seals at the top of the stairs, did it take the seals 15 minutes to reach him ? Did the two unarmed women between Osama and the seals slow them down that
much ?

Why did the chopper crash due to high altitude and hot weather when it was in the cool of the night and Abbotabad is only at an altitude of 1000 feet ?

Why did the seals fear Osama would detonate a suicide vest despite no evidence that Osama slept in one . Did they actually put worries for their own safety above the mission objective ?

Why did it take 23 minutes to blow up a downed blackhawk ? No breach team in the first wave seems a bit of an oversight — had to wait for deliveries from Pakistan to do the job ?

There are a lot of leaks coming out now as officials chafe with the knowledge that the Hollywood story fed to the public doesn’t add up. Even if it is so beloved by the wannabes.

Seal Team 6 was formed in the wake of Desert One. When things started going wrong did that bad PR weigh heavily on their minds ?

When the movie does eventually come out it’s likely to be as much about the ever changing PR following the botched mission as the mission itself.

“The SEAL Team Six training is intense. Their members fire more rounds of ammunition than the entire U.S. Marine Corps. The emphasis is on shooting skills, range firing, close-quarters battle (CBQ), and stress shooting in a variety of conditions.”

One has to ask whether a group that concentrates on shooting skills is the best to send on a snatch mission. Sounds like a team with better training in prisoner capture not just raiding would be a better idea.

Who said he is dead. You assume the Government didn’t lie. They didn’t release photographs. I personally didn’t see a body. OBL might be in the hull of a ship being interrogated right now. If the whole world believes he is dead he isn’t being protected by any bleeding hearts. Remember history is written by the victors.

Yep, there are still unanswered questions:
1) Has Oblat (Trekkie) finished doing the dishes for Mommy?
2) Is High School out for the summer and will Oblat have to attend summer school?
3) As the prime example of mediocrity and failure, does Oblat aspire to ‘averageness’?
4) Other than playing with his Toy Soldiers, does Oblat have ANY military experience?
5) Is Oblat a joke OR his he really that ignorant?

In an extremely hostile environment I believe most field personnel would prefer having an expert with weapons rather than a ‘cuff-em Dano’ guy. But then, you have watched all those TV shows and movies that tell you how to capture the bad guy. Of course, this makes you the expert. I guess the Seal program only teaches shooting skills; I am SO disappointed, I was under the impression the Seal Teams are comprehensively trained in all facets of warfare.……including ‘snatch missions’. Taking one quote from a press release is akin to saying “All Army paratroopers undergo intensive parachute-folding training” and your interpretation is that this is all they know. Your ignorance is staggering. My grandchildren have more intelligence and common sense than you could ever hope to possess. When you grow up, I truly hope you never have children. God help us if your genes are introduced into another human being!

The satantic bastard is dead.That’s all that counts.AMEN

Did Peta approve the dogs travel?

Is this guy really dead? Did we really capture him and then kill him and bury him at sea? Forget the pictures, i can photo-shop good ones of obl with holes in his head and hanging from a tulip off the grand canyon. According to a Secret memo dated 2004, obl was kill in a bombing. or the other secret memo, obl is actually bho… check out their features. must be time for another drink… believe what you want. i am still trying to figure out the kennedy murders and the moon landing… have a nice day.

it,s great operation to bring dead body of osama in pakistan .and to announce great victory of AMERICA​.so are so good in deceiving your innocent tax payers.when you will do some thing real,you will find the results different​.so leave to copy rambo,s first blood.…try some thing real.and the realities are always very hot.….….….…

I dont usually post but ‘right on’ LZ. Dont spend to much time with this loser.

If the story is true and it all sounds very plausible, we put together a outstanding plan to achieve the goal. The pilot of the downed Helo should get a big medal, Seal Team Six didn’t miss a beat with a sudden and major operational difficulty thrown at them. I think anyone who thinks we went there to capture him doesn’t understand how things work real world. The fact that we had a contingency force ready to come in and deal with the Paks if needed speaks volumes for a praise worthy plan. SOCOM commanders put together something special for the worst of the worst. They did well.

Right on!!!!!!!

Got that right and what are we “blessed” with? An idiot for a president (hurts to say that), who continues to throw Israel under the bus.….…. no.….….…. into the Grand Canyon!!!!!!!!

Got that right!!!

And how many missions have you flown??? Arm chair quarterbacking is alive an well.….…..

Couldn’t have said it better myself. I called him armchair quarterback. He couldn’t qualify for that either. I am not in, nor have ever served in the military. I heard enough horror stories from my WWII dad who was Flight Engineer and top turret gunner on a B-52. Things don’t always go according to “plan”. It’s how you react to the unexpected that counts. But, I can say this. I AM AN AMERICAN PATRIOT. All of these naysayers need to as you say “shut the F up”!!!

Right on, Boo. The Ospreys generally carry less of a load than the ‘60s and definitely less than the ‘47s. They are not “tactical” birds — they are cargo aircraft. This is a big problem for the Marines in Helmand Province right now. The USMC has essentially two types of birds supporting them out there: the CV-22s and the God-awful CH-53s that should have been retired and replaced decades ago. One of the biggest complaints of the Marines on the ground is the CV-22s and CH-53s require 72 hours notice and a pre-surveyed LZ before they will approve a mission!! This basically means the Marines are fighting in only two dimensions — they don’t have the air assault capability of the Army. Fortunately, their MEDEVAC is being handled by the Brit’s Merlin helos which don’t suffer from this lack of agility.

DIDOG: both the ‘47s and the ‘60s are perfectly capable aircraft with incredibly capable pilots on the stick. The CH/MH-47 is basically the only aircraft we have in our inventory that can operate fully at the altitudes required in Afghanistan. If you want to read about a great example, read Horse Soldiers by Doug Stanton. Have you ever seen a SOAR pilot maneuver an MH-47 on an approach to a FRIES insertion? It’s incredible how well a big, fat ’47 can maneuver. Have you ever participated in such an insertion? Do you even know what the hell I’m talking about?!?

The overall operation went off and was a success! Now the Seals did a hell of a job in getting the target and getting the H—- out of Dodge in one piece. Remember the Pakistani’s had their OCS school down the road. You know there had to be arms there and some of the ‘candidates’ in that school probably believed in OBL. Sure there were ‘problems’ in the operation but there are always going to be ‘problems’ in any operation. Either way hats off to the Seals, OOOHHHRRrraaaa

The operation was a success. The Seals did a great job and I am certain that Force Recon, Green Berets,and the combined services Delta Force all had touched the operation in some way. God Bless all of them and Thanks! from a grateful nation.

We old guys can smile at the capabilites of the new kids on the block! They are stronger, smarter, better equipped and demonstrate a love for America. We had it and never lost it! They carry it with pride.

Oblat, you are a MORON. Your response only exemplifies your unfaltering ignorance of anything in actual reality. Another thing your response makes painfully obvious is that you have never been involved in anything any more serious than a spat with one of your siblings.…Or maybe wishing you had siblings or quarrel with. Not sure whats wrong with you man, but you would not want to meet me ANYWHERE!

Do you even have a slight grasp of the english language??? Maybe enough to post on any web page???? Idiot!! “You are either part of the the solution or part of the problem”. You’re position is obvious!

No Shit shurlock! Go home and stay the hell out of our country!

You are a puss! Defininitely not an American or FREE PERSON. For whatever reason, you take it upon yourself to be a fat, hairy, stinking TROLL! I hope you rot in hell (with your 72 so-called virgins).

I believe we have a profile for Oblat now. He is 15–16 year old ‘Trekkie’ who comes from a lower income liberal family. He is an average student in school with no friends; a result of his living in a fantasy world. He believes he can make himself sound important by denigrating the character of anyone in the military. When he grows up he will think he is owed a living by anyone who works. The best avenue to maturity for this child is to send his butt to the USMC. He will either learn to be a man or remain a worthless parasite. Only time will tell. I note that he has refrained from posting; the SyFy channel must be running a Star Trek marathon. I have to give the kid a little break.….he obviously does not have any guidance.

Your summary is not correct.

1.) Under pressure are only a few and will NOT get credit.
2.) performance matter and LUCK DOES NOT have nothing to do with it.
3.) If you believe YOUR A failure YOU WILL ALWAYS BE A FAILURE
4.) Oblat is a looser and always be a looser.

MH-47G is an unbelievable bird. It is a different beast even from the CH-47F. I work on the airfield and in close proximity to both. MH-47G is quiet, stealthy and slippery. I’ve watched countless ops and the amazing skills of the pilots. A CH-47G hovering in a 30 knot crosswind with nary a twitch, ramp sitting on a slope and front gear in the air. And as for the Army flying 60s… While not my favorite bird (the Piasecki ring tailed Seahawk (X-49A) is very nice though) I’ve watched countless ops as well. You have no clue of which you speak!

So, he was killed at the end of the 40 minute period but he didn’t have time to reach his AK or his pistol. Uh-huh.

Have you always been a turd eating jerk?

SEALS, Rangers, etc. Go get more of the enemy, ASAP.…

Very serious flaws in this story. First of all inclusion of Chinooks, takes the Radar detection story out of the question, no proof Chinooks were stealth.

I advice the participants if they would search local eye witnesses account from Abbotabad. Witness after witness said, there were people on the ground speaking Pushtoo, knocking on the doors of the neighbours warning them not to come out of their houses during the operation.

The story on this page says one interpreter, so who were speaking to the locals in Pushtoo? You guys seriously think Pakistanis were not on board during this operation?

Ladies and Gentleman please give Mr. oblat a standing ovation for proving his ignorance and posting it on the internet. It’s not a sin to be ignorant or even Dum; Next time be sure to have some knowledge of whatever issue you are writting about. Mr. oblat just break out of a mental institution after been in a Psychotic state. (he’s out of touch with reality).

I would say that it the culture of excellence and success.

1. In a combat op you will always be under a lot of pressure, you expect that and you are trained to adjust to developing situations and you keep doing what needs to be done to complete a successful op. You seriously do not care about getting credit.

2. Luck is when you are well trained and well briefed on your assigned task as well as everyone else’s task assignment so that if the wheels start coming off the bus you can still complete you task and step in to someone’s else’s if necessary.

3. You are trained, equiped, and led by the best. Failure is never an option.

Justice? Seems like a well carried out death sentence. The felon admitted to the crime. They had no problems finding a vein to insert the needle. The felon didn’t complain. Was his justice better on 9/11?

Any fool can crash a chopper. How many fools crash choppers so that everyone walks away, and the people next door don’t notice?

You are a moron.

you obviously are not. just please google CH-47 Chinook

amen brother, some people just don’t get it.

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