Boeing shuttering Wichita plant

Boeing shuttering Wichita plant

In what may be a harbinger of the immediate future for the aerospace industry, Boeing just announced that it’s closing its Wichita, Kan., facility, home to its B-52 and KC-767 military programs, next year.

Boeing claims the plant is being closed due to a lack of future business opportunities for the site that also serves Boeing’s global transport and executive services arm (basically military VIP jets like Air Force One). “Business costs in Witchita are not competitive” in the maintenance, modifications and upgrades (MDS) business sector, said Mark Bass, Boeing Defense Space & Security’s VP for MDS during a conference call to discuss the plant closure.

“We know that there are many more difficult decisions [like this one] ahead of us,” added Bass.


The Wichita plant relies on maintenance modifications and upgrades contracts for older military jets. But, “over the last 18 months, the military market has changed dramatically,” said Bass. The “market is flat or declining” and  the MDS business arena “is very competitive and we compete against a number of smaller companies” and due to its enormous size, “Wichita is just not competitive” in the MDS arena, according to Bass.

Boeing’s 767-based KC-46 tanker program will now be based out of facilities around Puget Sound, Wash. This will put the facilities that turn 767s into KC-46s much closer to the Everett, Wash, plant that makes the 767.

Keep in mind that Boeing may take a loss making the first batch of 17 KC-46 tankers that it is making for the U.S. Air Force. This is because the company underbid EU subsidized rival EADS in the KC-X contest (the competition was often described as a price shootout) in order lock-in future contracts for the 179-plane KC-46 program that it will be able to turn a profit on.

“If we left the tanker here it would become unaffordable to our customer because the rest of the site would corrode,” added Bass. He would not discuss contracts that are winding down in Wichita. “It’s primarily the facilities and infrastructure costs here in witchita” that are leading to “tremendous inefficiencies.”

He went on to say the company’s competitiros in the maintenance and mods arena operate with “just two hangars and an office building” while Boeing’s two million square foot Wichita plant has 97 buildings.

“Labor costs are higher here than at our other sites,” he added.

Boeing executives made the decision to close the plant on December 30 after conducting a study last year to determine whether or not the facility should remain open, according to Bass, who said that officials had no idea that the facility would be closed when the KC-X contest was awarded last year. A local TV reporter on the conference call just pointed out that Boeing claimed last year that a KC-X victory would provide over 7,000 jobs in Kansas before asking increduclousy, “how can anyone in Kansas trust anything Boeing says anymore?”

Boeing estimates that 1,100 to 1,400 new jobs at company facilities in Oklahoma City and San Antonio will help offset the closure, according to Bass. There are 2,150 workers currently employed at the Witchita site. 200 jobs will be created at Boeing facilities around Puget Sound when the KC-46 tanker program moves there.

The legendary Wichita plant is co-located with McConnell Air Force Base, and produced everything from B-29s (shown above) to B-52s. (It’s where my old man checked out in B-47s)

Here’s the text of Boeing’s announcement of the facility’s closure:

The Boeing Company [NYSE: BA] today announced that the Boeing Defense, Space & Security (BDS) facility in Wichita will close by the end of 2013. The Wichita facility currently employs more than 2,160 employees.

“The decision to close our Wichita facility was difficult but ultimately was based on a thorough study of the current and future market environment and our ability to remain competitive while meeting our customers’ needs with the best and most affordable solutions,” said Mark Bass, vice president and general manager for BDS’ Maintenance, Modifications & Upgrades division. “We recognize how this will affect the lives of the highly skilled men and women who work here, so we will do everything possible to assist our employees, their families and our community through this difficult transition.”

Boeing Wichita is the base for the company’s Global Transport & Executive Systems business and its B-52 and 767 International Tanker programs. The facility also provides support for flight mission planning and integrated logistics.

Over the past five years, contracts in Wichita have matured, programs have come to a close or are winding down, and the site does not have enough sustainable business on the horizon to create an affordable cost structure to maintain and win new business.

“In this time of defense budget reductions, as well as shifting customer priorities, Boeing has decided to close its operations in Wichita to reduce costs, increase efficiencies, and drive competitiveness,” said Bass. “We will begin program transitions in the coming months, with the complete closure of the site scheduled for the end of 2013. We do not anticipate job reductions as a result of this decision until early in the third quarter of 2012.”

Bass said that Boeing will continue to have a significant impact on the Kansas economy and the health of the state’s aerospace industry.

“The company spent more than $3.2 billion with approximately 475 Kansas suppliers in 2011, spanning its commercial and defense businesses, making it the fourth largest state in Boeing’s supplier network,” said Bass. “Based on Boeing Commercial Airplanes growth projections for the next few years, Boeing anticipates even more growth for suppliers in Kansas. Boeing values its long-term partnership with Kansas, and we will continue to work with all of our stakeholders in Kansas in support of a robust aerospace industry in the state.”

Future aircraft maintenance, modification and support work will be placed at the Boeing facility in San Antonio. Engineering work will be placed at the Boeing facility in Oklahoma City. Although work on the KC-46 tanker will now be performed in Puget Sound, Wash., the 24 Kansas suppliers on the program will be providing vital elements of the aircraft as originally planned.

Boeing is providing employee assistance including retirement seminars, job search resources, and financial counseling, as well as help finding jobs inside or out of Boeing.

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Boeing, preserving American jobs!…that already exist…somewhere else.

Labor costs strongly emphasized. Hmm.. this has to do with the unions manipulating this plant I am betting. They just renewed a contract not too long ago for four more years. That would certainly hike up costs.

Boeing sucks.

With todays technology and competative world, what we need are modern Stealth Space Shuttle bombers production plants.

Were it not for them, we would not have the greatest bomber ever built — B-52 Stratofortress

They are far from ‘sucking’.

The FEDS should investigate Boeing.

Another nail in the coffin of the United States of America.

I supported the 767 tanker program so that plant would be busy , maybe we have found the true jeckle in the avation industry.

We can always count on CHINA to build our bombers and tankers, as someone runs Boeing out of business

“You have to give us the tanker program or we’ll have to close our Wichita plant!”

LIARS

Maybe Spirit Aerosystems will purchase that side of the road from them and expand their facility. That would help Spirit grow and salvage some of the jobs.

Yep Unions land another body blow to America. Unions are anti-American and They must be outlawed for America to survive.

Despite the fact that I liked the Boeing design better; I argued with my representatives office that the Airbus contract would have probably hired just as many American jobs, and one of their largest plants is in Wichita to boot. Looks like they should have gone with Airbus if they wanted jobs in Kansas.

Boeing is getting so many civilian contracts right now, I don’t see how they can afford to shut everything down. They will probably need many thousands of workers from both Spirit, and the other contractors that make spare parts around Wichita. You don’t get that kind of infrastructure over night. The market is exploding for Boeing right now — in fact — I hear rumors they will have to contract some of the work from AirBus USA to fill future contracts in time. If this is true — the Wichita AirBus plant will be busy-busy!

Good reply! Markets are fluid and have always been impacted by a thousand different forces, ebbing and flowing again. Boeing cannot control these though surely they wish they could. They have produced superior products that have enhanced, even preserved millions of lives in a thousand ways. They do not owe any man anything except to refrain from the whoopla of unsupportable promises when the good times are rolling.

Yep Unions are the problem
German car manufacturers make more than twice as many cars as American manufacturers. German auto workers earn an average of $67.14 in wages and benefits, while American auto workers earn an average of $33.77. We’re told that American auto workers need to accept pay cuts because they earn too much for the manufacturers to be profitable, yet German manufacturers are very profitable despite paying so much more. So, how does that work? http://​www​.dailykos​.com/​s​t​o​r​y​/​2​0​1​1​/​1​2​/​2​8​/​1​0​4​9​4​09/
Put the blame where it belongs
THE BEST GOVT MONEY CAN BUY

I can hardly wait to hear they’re moving KC-767’s manufacturing operations will be moving to China :-P

C’mon America, we can do better than this. I Pray Heavenly Father GOD in Jesus name, that YOU help us get our government and business in order. We can’t get it together without YOU.

The policies commented upon in this thread are the direct result of having poor leadership in Washington D.C. I am talking about the 503 elected officials that we the public have sent to D.C. to run the country. They have a long, long history of making bad decisions that affect the people of this nation. The voters have to shoulder at least 50% of the blame because we tend to make voting decisions for the wrong reasons. The other 50% of the blame rests with the bad decision makes we send to D.C. We need to take charge of this country before there is nothing left to take charge of. Most voters, if they do go to the polls, spend more time studying the menu for a Saturday night outing than they do the candidates they vote for. Reclaim America, vote all incumbents out of office.

Where did you get your numbers? I have no proof, but I thought I remember the average american union autoworker receives about $75 per hour in pay and benefits.

The Washington plant is also unionized, your argument is irrelevant.

Perfect example of why we’re fucked: Everyone’s praying, no one’s doing.

Oddly the biggest exporter of Daimler Benz cars currently is the US. If what you said is true why does Daimler Benz make so many of their cars in the us? The vast majority of manufacturing that has left the US was low end stuff. We have lots of high end well paid manufacturing jobs going begging right now because our unionized and tenured education system is more comfortable cranking out know nothing Liberal Arts students than producing world class engineers and technical workers. Our current education system is not able to change with technology because it is taught by seniority and tenure that last a lifetime.

BARRY, BAAAARRRRYYYY. HURRY WE NEED A BAILOUT. NOT FOR BOEING SAKE, FOR THE UNION OF COURSE!!

The company’s competitors in the maintenance and mods arena operate with “just two hangars and an office building”

Oh Yeah?
I got 2 illegals in ’79 Ford pickup that will fix your jet in the Wal-Mart parking lot.

ya, put unions in office in the DC Offices, than watch America go to he** in a hand basket

Great Article how outsourcing has cost Boeing’s 787 program $Billions in additional cost and lost sales

A ‘prescient’ warning to Boeing on 787 trouble

In a late January appearance at Seattle University, Boeing Commercial Airplanes Chief Jim Albaugh talked about the lessons learned from the disastrous three years of delays on the 787 Dreamliner.

One bracing lesson that Albaugh was unusually candid about: the 787’s global outsourcing strategy — specifically intended to slash Boeing’s costs — backfired completely.

“We spent a lot more money in trying to recover than we ever would have spent if we’d tried to keep the key technologies closer to home,” Albaugh told his large audience of students and faculty.

–snip–

Some Wall Street analysts estimate those added costs at between $12 billion and $18 billion, on top of the $5 billion Boeing originally planned to invest.

http://​seattletimes​.nwsource​.com/​h​t​m​l​/​s​u​n​d​a​y​b​u​z​z​/​2​0​1​412

Great Article how outsourcing has cost Boeing’s 787 program $Billions in additional cost and lost sales

A ‘prescient’ warning to Boeing on 787 trouble

In a late January appearance at Seattle University, Boeing Commercial Airplanes Chief Jim Albaugh talked about the lessons learned from the disastrous three years of delays on the 787 Dreamliner.

One bracing lesson that Albaugh was unusually candid about: the 787’s global outsourcing strategy — specifically intended to slash Boeing’s costs — backfired completely.

“We spent a lot more money in trying to recover than we ever would have spent if we’d tried to keep the key technologies closer to home,” Albaugh told his large audience of students and faculty.

–snip–

Some Wall Street analysts estimate those added costs at between $12 billion and $18 billion, on top of the $5 billion Boeing originally planned to invest.

This is just business. The labor unions priced their product out of the market.

Nothing said in any article about new capability going into Charleston SC. Wonder how Charleston will play in Boeing’s plans?

Not so long ago Boeing was talking about completely moving out of Seattle, with most of their manufacturing capacity going to Wichita. With property prices going up in Seattle as fast as 50% a year and due to the land locked nature of the Seattle — Tacoma area (pinned between the mountains on one side and the Puget Sound on the other) there’s no new land to be had for any price there. The fact is, Boeing is a huge empty shell of a company just like the rest of the major defense contractors. They outsource everything and their so-called “manufacturing facilities” are nothing more than glorified parts warehouses. They are no more a weapons manufacturer than your house was a bicycle manufacturing plant the night before Christmas.

Clearly you dont know how much work went into the manufacture of my Christmas bicycle.

They did. The NLRB was suing them for opening a plant in SC and providing a couple thousand jobs while not losing any jobs in Seattle. Somehow the FEDS decided that wasn’t fair to their biggest lobby, the labor unions. The FEDS then held them hostage until wringing concessions out of the company in order to allow them to open a new facility in a new state. Was this what you had in mind?

Been Saying this for years–Americans are dumber than a box of rocks–all they focus on is the Administration(s) that have governed yet it is the yokels up on Capital Hill who have sent this country down this path. Let’s force term limits and vote the idiots out.

I can do it with one Mexican in a much smaller Taco Bell parking lot. American Greed!!!

There goes one of the places were we actually still build things in this country…

Maybe what BOEING and its employees needs to do is to consider this:

1. To stay employed, employees take a paycut, like 5%.
2. BOEING needs to consider other aircraft, but mainly for civilian use, like the ekranoplan the Russian made not so long ago. Think UPS, FedEx, North/South Pole missions, & small island joy riding.
http://​membres​.multimania​.fr/​d​r​a​c​k​e​n​/​E​k​r​a​n​o​p​l​a​n/p
http://​www​.travelcentre​.com​.au/​t​r​a​v​e​l​/​A​v​i​a​t​i​o​n​/Im
http://​inhabitat​.com/​w​p​-​c​o​n​t​e​n​t​/​b​l​o​g​s​.​d​i​r​/​1​/​f​i​les

Nothing wrong with praying, as a matter of fact we can use more, that said, God does expect us to get off our @$$e$ and do something.

I hate seeing ANY of our manufacturing sector being closed, and I feel very sad for these people losing their jobs. I guarantee you that with our defense being so depleted and worn out over the last 10 years, there is plenty of things that we need to build that would have kept this plant open, oh yeah no money? Yeah no money for our defense, yet plenty of money for the Welfare state, bailouts, and the rest of the World’s defense.

Not really Adam. His comment is completely relevent, just that there is no matter between your ears.

You are chalk full of lies there. You have your figures reversed.

The UAW has been helping for years. I worked at Boeing for years, the average productivity of a line worker is about 50% at best. Knew a couple of Mechs. that worked 3 years without a day off, only those during Xmas maintenance break, you put 2 and 2 together.

Boeing-Wichita has 2150 workers in 97 buildings, and the company’s competitiros in the maintenance and mods arena operate with “just two hangars and an office building”?

Any consideration to closing/selling some buildings and properties that obviously are not needed, to cut costs? With an average of only 22 workers per building for maintenance and modification, and assembly work, that seems excessive anyway.

I think the reasons given for closing the plant do not actually touch upon the thinking from within Boeing.

The Daily KOS, really? They have no interest in making U.S. unions look good. This is one of the people who put obama in the White House.

Some more of ovomit’s “change we can believe in”. He will not be satisfied until America is totally destroyed by his, (and others like him), socialist agenda and total control over Americans, while at the same time violating the COnstitution of the United States of America. And members of congress and the senate are allowing him to do this. WHY????

I think that you are perhaps playing with the answer.…. if HaHa’s numbers are exactly right, and the benefits cost cost 46.23 per hour.….of course some of those “benefits” might include the premium paid to allow universal medical coverage and all of the other subtle “taxes” imposed on the american workers.

But then I suspect that you and I do not pay union dues.

They close one plant, and open another one in the south where it is non-union friendly. I mean, why pay somebody $20 an hour when you can pay somebody else $10 an hour and deplorable working conditions to do the same work? It’s cheeper for boeing to close the Wichita plant, it has nothing to do with the “Changing Market. The south is still in a slave labor’s mindset, except now it’s happening to everybody, thats why the repubs want to control it(south).…forever.

Did you know that the unions started mostly in the south, and even back then the repubs fought it tooth and nails, it was called “Union Busting”, a lot of workers(blue collar) was killed during that time. I am not a union worker in case you’re wondering, I just believe in honest pay for a honest day’s work, that use to be what we were all about, those times are gone in the south, and the repubs want to do that all over the Country, but Ohio shocked the $#!+ out of them. And in case you are wondering what is really killing America, ask the man that use to make $20 an hour ten or fifteen years ago and now he make $10 an hour for doing the same job. The only ones getting rich here is Corporate HQ, and their investors, because you, as a laborer sure as h-ll ain’t, but HEY!!, you got a job, and that’s all that matters

I saw some of the same commentary on the “lessons learned’ about outsourcing. Boeing seems to have caught the “PowerPoint Promise” disease that has long plagued DoD. Someone needs to move up the ladder so they come up with a “bright idea” and support it with great presentations. They get their promotions and the recipient of the presentations gets to live the unintended consequences, often diametrically opposite to the presentations’ conclusions!

In this case, Im thinking it could be more than just forgetting to include the shipping costs! LOL!

Went digging a bit and found this, Hart-Smith’s original paper:
http://​www​.documentcloud​.org/​d​o​c​u​m​e​n​t​s​/​6​9​7​4​6​-​h​art

Talk about a smoking-gun “Pearl Harbor Memo”! I want this guy picking my PowerBall numbers! LOL!

Just a thought, but.… . .… I have got to wonder what this REALLY says about the DoD penchant for spreading the “pork” of a program around to every possible congressional district!

Why you say? I read a report yesterday that explains why obama does many of these brainless things. It all boils down to power. This ingrate is on a power rush, hence is reason for signing into law “his” National Defense Authorization Act, an act that is far worse than the Patriot Act. Only a power craized mad man would have considered something like this. Then have the audacity to write, “I sign this bill with much reservation.” Yeah, riiight, with about as much reservation as you had when you signed the obamacare bill.

Americans really need to wake up and smell what this man has been shoveling since he entered office, and it isn’t snow, the man is a Narcissist.

Boeing is not an American company; look at how much work they ship overseas on pursuit of foreign orders, then wave the flag when they need political interference to get another Government contract; the politicians, IAM and Boeing deserve each other.

I bet the National Labor Relations board does nothing unlike their rant against the Carolina plant. They will say nothing because Kansas is a solid Republican state and the NLRB will care less (read the Obama administration) and will let it go. Labor loses again at the hand of the very political party (Democrats) that claim to be its protector. They only protect the ones that provide the most money to their re-eleciton campaigns. Sad, really sad. Obama is the biggest fraud to hit this Nation in a hundred years and the very people he is defrauding are the people that elected him. He has successfully screwed them and been kissed by the even though he has.

Having difficulty post so as a reply:

No they don’t. I got laid off becasue the number of military hospital replacements have also stopped an dthat is what I did. Design them. We still want to make sure they don’t keep going with foreign contactors but they still are going to get cut as we pare back our need airplanes.

Remember the B-17 and the B-29 shown

Watch that one be the next to go in five more years…

THESE PLACES ARE CLOSING UNDER HIS WATCH AND THERE WILL BE MANY MORE TO COME,IT COMES FROM UNION COST,LOCAL COST AND LACK OF NEW PROGRAMS TO CARRY THE FACTORY.…

They lied and now trying to figure out how to stay in the black..! They never could compete with airbus on the tanker bid.. They simply lied to win.. Now trying to pull a miracle!

Stop jumping on the Unions. Obviously there are those of you who do not know the history of the businesses versus the labor force. For just a sample of this, you should read up on old man Ford. They way he treated his labor force. The government needs to ban companies from doing business with the American people and the American government if they outsource or have their companies in foreign countries. We need to go back to being the people we use to be. Taking care of our own business by doing our business here and here alone. Products coming to this country should be set at a price that does not drive out the American business man. We need to grab a hold of ourselves!!

Business is business! At least they are not going out of business or taking a stimulus payment from the government! Just wait when all those cushy contracts expire and the Defense Dept starts to bring those jobs back in “house”. There are many military on a daily basis that are doing NOTHING ALL DAY LONG. Yes they might be support, but remember for every 1 military on the front line there are 7 doing basically very little work per day. Iraq is over and the deployment schedule is starting to disappear. Boeing is a business that is doing what is required to stay afloat. Airbus would love to have that contract! Just think how much that would stifle the local economy!

get rid of Union… then our manufacturing jobs will exist. Union protect LAZY people!!!!

Why did the editor remove my comment criticizing the obama adminiatration for not supporting defense oriented manufacturing?

Everyone complained because the Airbus is non-American, even though it would have been assembled in the US. Meanwhile Boeing outsources half of the 777, to include stuff from China. Comon, tell me that more and more $h1t wont come from China. In ten years, half of the electronics built in the new tanker with have made in China parts. And like EVERYTHING from China, it’s cheap at first, but then you have to replace it every year.

The problem was not unions, it was a facilities and infrastructure mess. Ninety-seven buildings, most of them no doubt quite old, energy-inefficient, and in need of reconfiguration — Boeing would have needed a steady, predictable future income stream to upgrade a campus of this size. Cold War era orders would have done it, but Boeing can read the tea leaves as well as the rest of us on military budgets for the next few years. They would have hemmoraged money keeping this place open. So they chose to make a painful but economically smart decision to keep their fiscal house in order.

As for promises to keep the plant open if they got the contract — I don’t believe that was part of the bid process or a factor in awarding them the bid. Bloggers have a way of sifting thousands of emails and off-the-cuff quotes to find a couple that support their view, but a company is thousands of people speaking every day, and I don’t believe there was ever a top-level Boeing policy commitment to keep this plant open no matter what the economy did.

One would figure if the Unions are squeezing too much out of boeing, then they should work out something that would make them more competitive, less pay or something. I find it hard to believe that the wages in Kansas are higher than they are in Seattle. I don’t think we are getting the entire truth.

Please do your research on the labor force before Unions and labor laws. Child labor laws are just the tip of the iceberg on the need to stop the abuse of the handful of “all for me” business men. This is just like the rest of life. Everyone has to suffer for the few. And thanks but I don’t consider myself LAZY. I work harder in this Union protected job than any other and I use to work in the stock brokerage business. Talk about stress!!

You Know , YOU really do give Rednecks a bad name !!!!
Proud, Praying Redneck — We’ll getter Done — when we get rid of the Pretend President

Maybe the a different branch of the feds should be looking at the garbage going on at the NLRB. The machinist’s union screwed Boeing and the NLRB made sure it happened.

Look no further than the machinist’s union in the Seattle area. They put the screws to Boeing with the assistance of the NLRB. Wichita needs to send the union a huge thank you card for shutting them down.

Boeing was telling the truth. Blame the machinist’s union and the NLRB for the crap they pulled in Seattle.

Adam — the machinist’s union and the NLRB forced this on Boeing. Get your head out.

You need to do a bit of reading on all the problems unions are causing Boeing in manufacturing sites across the country. It has become a case of the tail wagging the dog.

The unions in the Seattle area are the problem. They continue to demand ever-higher wages and then get bent out of shape when Boeing tries to streamline manufacturing by moving 787 capacity to Georgia. The union went to the NLRB and filed a garbage complaint, which the NLRB actually pursued! The unions are not interested in “working something out”. They plan to suck Boeing dry. Looks like Boeing will go down the same road as GM. Thanks to the unions and a corrupt NLRB.

The jobs are “going begging” because people aren’t willing to move to North Nowhere at their own expense and take a pay cut just to have a job.

Haha, I guess MRO is another one of those “jobs Americans just won’t do” :D

I spent the Thanksgiving holiday visiting family in Charleston, and apparently there’s plenty of competition for jobs at that assembly plant, so I guess everyone down there likes being exploited. I dunno, maybe it’s some kind of S&M thing?

There are several issues in dealing with Wichita, that have not been discussed that are not Labor related. It used to be simple for Boeing Commercial to transfer the corporate costs from Seattle to Wichita. Once the first part of the plant was sold there wasnt the base to transfer the corporate costs to. Shedding Boeing overhead is probably why Spirit is so quickly viable. Second, Wichita is still the Air Captial of the nation it always was(chuckle). It just wont have Steerman or Boeing, it will be Spirit and Hindustan Aeronautics, COMAC or L-3 . Boeing must have gotten its FAA Certs in line for Kelly and OK city, it doesnt need an under utilitsed KC-135 rebuild facilities, since the number of KC-135 will be going down year by year over the next 30 years. Building the KC-45 in line is a lesson learned in efficiency from the P-8a. The fortunate thing is the Dole and Tihart are not in power to force it being finished in Wichita. I wonder how long until McConnell AFB is closed now that Boeing is Gone. Maybe the Chinese will buy it all with Tax Incentive Financing and turn it into their Aero Cargo Hub(dare I say Sphere of Influence) instead of St Louis.

The labor unions are still doing quite healthy business in Wichita, they’re just doing it for Spirit Aero and in place of Boeing today.

Charleston’s focus on 787 work, it might expand beyond that but only if Boeing can prove its got the business case to do so.

You’ve obviously never been to their Everett or Renton facilities, or Boeing Field, or know what you’re talking about at all.

The thinking in Boeing is that they need to consolidate operations to streamline. Since most of the Kansas plant was spun off into Spirit Aero, the remaining Boeing presence became an increasingly inefficient use of resources. By moving the remainder of the “Boeing” Wichita work to other facilities they’re bringing their costs down, and Spirit will still employ Thousands in Kansas.

Get rid of the Unions and the manufacturing jobs will exist, in China.

Quickly, quickly all Kan Congressmen and Senators put some earmarks in somebill to have the Air Force buy some planes they don’t want. I hate to see this happen but everybodyu hold on to your hats because the military is about to be gutted and the defense industry will also be gutted by our fourth greatest President to hear him tell it. HOPE AND CHANGE NOBAMA/NOBIDEN 2012

The unions have made it where American facturys and other plants have to close or move to another country. Its been that way along time and will keep up.

It’s simple zero sum. Given the looming defense cuts and current contracts winding down there is work for two sites vs. three. Wichita was significantly more expensive than San Antonio or OK City. Wichita cost is driven mainly by massive overhead due to 2M square feet of barely utilized facility. Tanker production rates of a couple a month won’t fill one hanger. Wichita current and future work can be moved to those two sites with no facilities expansion.

Yeah, what do I know. Just keep pretending it’s all ok. Keep sleeping, that will make everything ok. Idiot.

Did you machine the gears, grind the bearings, rivet the chain, weld the frame? No, you did just like Boeing does, you assembled parts. The lowest skilled job is the only one Americans have left. And then we congratulate ourselves on our ever increasing productivity. What a joke. I hope that hollow shell with the Boeing logo on it can continue to keep America just as safe as it deserves to be.

I agree with what you say, I would also add that the Congress lets him get away with it for a few reasons: one of course is that he has a majority of the Senate backing him up, the other is that the opposition has NO guts to stand up to him and the State-run Press. The opposition was elected to get in there and stop this out of control spending/nanny state cr @p, yet once they got in they quickly lost their nerve and they also enjoy the benefits of the “Washington Life”.

Who knew that ragging and trying to destroy the Unions would cure all the ills of the business in America!?!?!?! Really?? For those who wish to live as a pauper and slave to corporate America, go for it!!

Airbus does not have a ‘plant’ in Wichita, they have engineering office where they employ engineers they poach from other aerospace companies in the area.

I don’t disagree though that the Airbus tanker would have created just as many jobs in the US probably, possibly even some in Wichita (i.e., Spirit Aerosystems).

I think he does know what he’s talking about, he’s right that Boeing really just assembles aircraft now, they subcontract out basically all of their fabrication. In the case of the 737, Spirit in Wichita manufactures the entire fuselage and it’s put on a train an shipped to Washington where Boeing assembles it. The 787 is fabricated all over the world and shipped by plane, train, and automobile … err, truck, to Washington, and now South Carolina, where it is assembled. Of course there is still a lot of Boeing expertise that goes into it, but to say they only assemble the aircraft is pretty accurate I think.

So I guess it’s a choice between being a slave to corporate America or a slave to the union bosses; if the corporate execs are so bad, why do you expect the union bosses to be any better?.….

What does what happened in Seattle have to do with closing the plant in Kansas?

What’s up with the caps. Mad annoying.

WOW! A airbus cargo/tanker factory in Mobile, Alabama, with 20,000 jobs is starting to look like the bargin of the century. Airbus and Wictha all gone to preserve 4500 union jobs in Washington state. Its just politics. Its not time for a election, its time for THE Military Coup.

They were building wing sections there when I lived in Wichita, my bad for assuming they had a plant.

That was my experience when I was there; the union was totally worthless! Boeing relied more on peripheral contractors to meet time expectations, because they couldn’t get squat for productivity out of the union.

He’s probably right the way unions try to get a strangle hold on corporations. I don’t know what the union laws are in Oregon, but Kansas is a right-to-work state. Perhaps the union wants to punish any state that has a right to work?!

If the three posters above are any indication, the soon to be laid-off union workers will be able to keep their houses outta the clutches of the BoA by getting into the burgeoning armored* tinfoil hat manufacturing business…

*armored because donch’a know that the sky is ALWAYS falling when you’re a wingnut.

Can’t quite figure out how, but it must be Obama’s fault.…

Yeah, look at how bad old union labor screwed Boeing on the 787. Oh wait, that was their foreign suppliers that screwed them on the 787. And to say thanks, Boeing is outsourcing more, not less. Pay that CEO a few million more every year.

GM took a bail out, and then opened a new facility in Communist Red China.

No, get rid of the unions and Americans will work under the same conditions as those in the sweat shops in China. That’s what they really want to do is turn America into China. After all, the red, white, and blue doesn’t stand for anything anymore. We’re just a part of the world market. Nothing special about us.

The union leaders have become as corrupt as the thugs in Washington. Fix that and then we’ll discuss unions.….

The Unions are only one piece of the pricing on any program such as the KC. The buildings are another. Energy is another. Then there is overhead expenses such as the executives. Add all items up and then put 20 % profit margin on top. Then we have the starting point for the performance bonuses of the same executives.
Boeing hasn’t changed its Modus Operandi since before 1960. Nothing is going to change now.

Yeah, I agree with you there. The unions need to be “fixed” not eliminated. Those who seek to eliminate unions have no knowledge of history or seek to repeat some of the darkest days of the industrial revolution. Dark days that gave rise to Communism. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.

It needs to transform from B-52 plant to modern X-37B and secured and modern VTOL plant to cut waste.

There is no way a FINAL ASSEMBLY line of 95+% parts manufactured overseas employs as many workers as a PRODUCTION LINE of >70% parts manufactured in the US (many on cite/in the same building complex).

Only ~30% of the 767 & 777 parts are manufactured overseas.

The Federal Government ACTIVELY prevents Boeing from moving workshare away from union controlled areas to areas that are not controlled by unions.

Try reading the article…

YOU should look at actually how comparatively little work Boeing ships overseas. Yes I know it must seem like a lot to such a small minded fool as yourself but as a % of total workshare Boeing & its US subcontractors does it really is not. And you are even more of a fool if you think Boeing actually WANTS to shift workshare overseas. It is the nature of the airliner design & manufacturing business that some workshare ‘must’ be done overseas.

Quite the opposite.

Remember most of all the Obama Stimules programs have been geared to producing governmant and NON government UNION JOBS

“To stay employed, employees take a paycut, like 5%” More like Management and UNION leaders at Boeing need to take a pay cut

Try reading my post; in fact Bombardier is hiring some 800 workers and is quite happy to absorb the former Boeing people. Things are hopping pretty good in airtown. I’ve heard that even Airbus will be building parts for Boeing in Wichita. Only one aircraft manufacturer there is not planning an expansion of business or infrastructure.

Nobody wants those old tattered buildings; they are just bloat overhead for Boeing. San Antonio will take up some of the slack. They haven’t quite closed all the military maintenance/repair centers there ‘yet’.

That would make little difference to an individual state, as they would still get the same amount of business. I should have delineated that in my statement.

It is rather difficult to ship a wing section to France for final assembly, I hadn’t seen anywhere where that is done.

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