DoD civilian furloughs expected to start in April

DoD civilian furloughs expected to start in April

The Pentagon’s No. 2 civilian told a group of defense reporters Friday that civilian employees furloughs would likely start in April if Congress forced the Defense Department to execute sequestration cuts and extended the continuing resolution in March.

Deputy Defense Secretary Ashton Carter explained that civilians working for the Defense Department will likely have to take one unpaid furlough day per week from April until September — the end of the fiscal year.

The U.S. military is facing severe budget cuts that could amount to about $52 billion in 2013 when combining the sequestration cuts and the extension of the continuing resolution. Pentagon leaders have until September to make the cuts.


Panetta and Army Gen. Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said the Defense Department will have to start taking actions such as furloughs, reducing travel and laying off temporary employees. Defense officials estimate that civilian furloughs will save about $5 billion.

The Defense Department has about 800,000 civilian employees. Pentagon officials said they don’t plan to lay off these positions. However, the Defense Department will eliminate the 46,000 temporary civilian positions.

“This is painful to us,” Carter said.

Carter held out hope that Congress would come to an agreement end the CR and avoid sequestration. However, the Pentagon has to take steps now to ease the burden of the potential cuts.

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So with forces being withdrawn, employees a day off a week. Is this when we’re suppose to accept Osama accomplished the goal of destroying our economy? I mean it says ““We’ll be unable to reset the force following a decade of war” Dempsey. So NOW would be a good time for another terror attack? I mean we sure couldn’t afford it! What kind of weakness are we portraying if our Government can’t even hire a good accountant over the last 8 years?

I’m hoping that the cuts go through. Big cuts in government spending would be really good for us overall. Sequestration has a good chance to force the military to stop wasting billions buying white elephant projects like the F-35 ($400 billion) and LCS (roughly $42 billion). Speaking from the Navy side, we can’t afford to buy these new expensive, dysfunctional platforms and keep ships deployed while spending more to keep well trained personnel manning our ships. Something has to give. The sooner it gives the sooner the problem is solved. I think Sequestration will bring about just that.

Indeed, however I worry if the powers that be will allow intelligent cuts anyhow. After all, this latest 4.6 billion dollar navy shortfall was taken mostly out of maintenance. If you need proof that too many people in power just don’t care, look at how maintenance was the first thing on the chopping block. After all, the F-35 project has sunk a trillion dollars, and every acquisition person in power is going to succumb to the sunk costs fallacy on that project.

What’s really interesting in all this is,
everywhere we look we see one new defense contract after another being signed, money being spent (or at least ~contractually guarantedd~ to be spent), yet threats that we have to cut cut cut to even just survive.

Let’s start by cut cut cutting foreign aid to nations who’ve made it clear they only want to be a welfare state fed by the American taxpayer teat, nations who can’t keep control over their various belief groups who’ve made it quite clear they’d rather see Americans’ throats cut and servicemembers killed and maimed.
Let’s start by suddenly and permanently weaning those welfare-state nations off of the vast amounts of foreign aid that, obviously, have NOT been in our nation’s best interests.
How many billions then does that free up to shore up our own economy, which is where it should spent in the first place?

BlackOwl, I don’t disagree that we have a lot of projects that can shoulder some of this burdern. However, as a federal employee, I myself can not shoulder a 20% pay cut for the rest of FY13. I by no means make a great deal of money to start with and now I might be left with thousands of dollars less. If this happens I’m left with the questions of how do I provide a roof for my family, food, and pay my bills.

So the answer to the Navy’s scrupulous spending like the ones you mentioned is to lay off thousands of employees? How does that make sense? Take the spending budget away from such projects. I’m a GS nurse and could quite possibly be included in this furlough. What’s going to happen when they send me home, and then they start deploying the corpsmen and there’s no civilian staff to back up the hospitals? Brian is right on…we are looking weaker and weaker, and countries are going to start taking advantage of that.

We’ve been weak for a long time and countries have been taking advantage of that weakness for a long time, too. We need to stop most of the (billions of dollars each year) foreign aid that that we dole out each year to foreign countries (many of which hate the U.S. but love our $$$) and start pouring that money into our own back yard. We could use that money to help fix our deficit, feed our hungry, and house our homeless. Not to mention the jobs that we could generate here in the states.

It’s downright stupid that huge acquisition projects are occurring while the DoD is apparently struggling to fund workers and (At least in the navy) maintenance. Blanket sequestration is bad because as we have seen, the current leaders aren’t going to hurt the pet projects that are costing massive sums and simply push it off to the real core of the budget. The army is also working on two new APC/IFV class vehicles, and supporting a big fleet of MRAPS, replacing the HMMWV. The amount of new gear in the pipe is insane when they can’t pay basic bills.

How about giving the employee the option to take all furlough days consecutive without the supervisors approval?

“feed our hungry, and house our homeless”

I thought we were attacking the welfare state.

What would Ayn Rand say?

Considering that many governmental agencies see it as their perogative to fight for budget pie instead of being cost-effective, we’re doomed. Hey, we were too efficient this year and have too much surplus-if we don’t squander it now they will take it away next year.

Perhaps the real question is why are so many Americans who rise to positions of leadership in the public and private sectors possessors of this mentality?

Cut Welfare, All Aid to illegal aliens! Also cut all aid to illegal aliens; this should include medical care (As Tri-Care is being cut for military retirees who have earned it,) all education, and housing funds for illegals. Cut financial aid to mothers who have more than two babies out of Wedlock, the first two might be mistakes, after that the babies were most likely for welfare money!Then only consider minimal cut’s to the military, America needs a strong military, not a strong Welfare system.

Rush ‘2112’ comes to mind.

I keep hearing about these mysterious funds for illegals, and wonder where I can get some of them. Considering every time I apply for any assistance, I have to send in buckets of paperwork and multiple proofs of citizenship, even if it’s just a screening to see what I could possibly get, it makes me wonder how to bypass that. And babies for welfare is also a good one, considering you can look up welfare payment schedules, the payments aren’t anywhere near enough for raising a kid. You’d lose money on that scheme. And this is all besides the point, we already have and can have a strong military with less money. The amount of military funds wasted on internal politics and white elephants is mindboggling.

When making a bold statement like “We need to stop most of the (billions of dollars each year) foreign aid that that we dole out each year to foreign countries (many of which hate the U.S. but love our $$$) and start pouring that money into our own back yard.” Do you and the other free speaking citizens understand that this amount “eventhough to us common labors seems to be a lot” is in fact only a little more than 1% of the current national budget. And that foreign aide provides for and adirectly support over 20 million US local jobs in providing this aide to other countries. The billions you speak of (Department of State/USAID budget totals $51.6 billion) being utilized locally could help, but what would you say to the 20 million workers who no longer have a job because once again the “average great american thinks foreign aide is a lot”. Being a retired Marine who has been on the giving end foreign aide to countries of need allows me to smile and hold my head high when “declaring I am an American, and I am here to help!” Semper Fi

The problem with government cuts is that instead of identifying and eliminating wastful spending, they just cut payroll (furloughs, retirement incentives, cut temp workers, cut COLA). This doesn’t solve ANY problems and puts further strain on thousands of america families. Then once they have gotten their pats on the back for cutting government spending by $X , they will hire people back, abolish furloughs and we will be right back in the same situation because the REAL problem wasn’t fixed.

The parent that is illegal does not qualify but the child that is illegal is qualified.

They may qualify, but they still have no way of meeting the paperwork requirements. I dislike bloated bureaucracy, but in this case any flaw in the qualification system is outdone by the requirements to be screened. You have to have tons of proofs, at least in my state. For children you need notarized proof of citizenship, and all applicants require at least 3 proofs of permanent residence. Illegals generally can’t meet those requirements.

How about shutting down the pointless, wasteful programs like JSF, GCV, LCS, etc. and then fire about half of the Govt employees (they don’t do anything anyway). That would be a great way to save money in the DoD and get more bang for the buck. The Govt waste in DoD is atrocious especially when it comes to the 18 to 1 Govt employee to contractor overwatch. I go to meetings all the time and watch a room full of Govt employees sleep while they rake in the per diem.

Government is attacking the worker bees. Why not furlough Congress their salary would more than cover the economy’s problems. How are government employees going to pay their bills and put food on the table? I think the American People are being used as pawns by our Government.

Now everyone will know what it was like to serve in a hollow military, as I did in the late 70’s. The problem to us was that the politician’s didn’t understand the ramifications of their actions, sound familiar? In a hollow military there is alot of senior personnel, junior personnel, and virtually no mid career personnel. The brunt of the watches and lack of proper maintenance time falls on the unlucky few that are left. Then there is the specter of a new draft to reduce benefits to the military personnel. We are treading familiar ground here, just aren’t very many left around who remember it.

I say we save money by cutting Congress’s pension plan. They can work 4 years and make salary doing nothing for the rest of their lives? What happened to ‘no law shall apply to Congress that doesn’t appy to the people, and vice versa?’ They’re not doing their job, furlough them! And get rid of their pension!

frickin foreign banksters (rotzchildz banking cartel) bankrupting us thru trillions in bailouts from the bansters private reserved printing press is drain number 1 if you don’t realize that yet, then trillions in laundered money going to the banksters through the opium trade in AFghan, then the trillions going to security companies, and the missile makers, and bomb makers, etc…then come home and we spend zillions in foreign aid to bankster buddies and other gangsters and then the welfare babies and momma’s and paying for illegals to breed like rabbits and etc etc etc etc.…it’s amazing we have a country left at ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!

Check the overtime, recent promotions, contract support, and senior level salaries.

Don’t blame DoD for this. DoD does not decide where to spend the money. Congress dictates what programs the DoD shall execute. Even when military leaders protested buying additional C-17’s for example, congress passed legislatioin ordering DoD to procure more. Lobbyists funded by the big military contractors “convince” (bribe, coerce, blackmail) members of congress to support this often wasteful legislation in order to support corporate welfare.

Under FERS, members of Congress are eligible for a pension
at age 62 if they have completed at least five years of service. Members are eligible
for a pension at age 50 if they have completed 20 years of service, or at any age after
completing 25 years of service. The amount of the pension depends on years of
service and the average of the highest three years of salary. By law, the starting
amount of a Member’s retirement annuity may not exceed 80% of his or her final
salary.
http://​www​.senate​.gov/​r​e​f​e​r​e​n​c​e​/​r​e​s​o​u​r​c​e​s​/​p​d​f​/​RL3

Overtime — gone
Promotions — gone
New Hires — gone
Temp Employees — Gone
Contract Support — Cut
20% of 800000 DoD employees pay — Going
20% of the taxes DoD employees pay to Federal State and Local Coffers — Going
Discretionary Spending by 800000 employees to local economies — Gone
20% (and more) Support to the Military forces in war, afloat and in training — Gone

I accept and agree cuts HAVE to happen but the people (by furlough) that are being cut are only pawns and will end the end hurt the military forces that defend this country.

The aid they get is used to buy american military equipment and sweeten deals that are strategically important to america. they dont just get fed american tax dollars.

Lets just think about this for a moment. You are going to furlough 800,000 civilian employees 1 day a week for the rest of the fiscal year. You realize that is a 20% cut in their pay; 20% less money to be spent on the economy; 20% less to receive federal and state income tax on. Now does that make sense? The economy is in the crapper now why make it worse. So you save $5 billion but look at what Obama has spent:

[quote] In fiscal 2008, the government spent a total of $11.427 billion in international assistance programs, according to the Monthly Treasury Statement. In fiscal 2011, according to the statement, it spent $20.599 billion—an increase of $9.172 billion, or 80 percent, from 2008.[/quote]

So does it make sense to hurt your own country’s economy with furloughs? To hell with international assistance we need domestic assistance. Lets drop back to what we spent in 2008 for international assistance programs.

Thank you. I get so tired of hearing this misinformation being spread around. Congress gets the same retirement and healthcare benfits that all federal employees get. Some are in CSRS…some are in FERS +TSP.

So how exactly again has it been strategically important to weaken our economic condition to our current state, exactly?
As to giving them financial aid just so they can turn it back to us by buying our equipment,…what exactly is that accomplishing?
It would be much more sensible if those welfare nations gave us something worthwhile in exchange.
You want US presence and all the benefits to your nation’s economy? Start ponying up a majority of the funding for us to be there.
You want US protection? Give us (not sell, GIVE) oil, valuable natural resources, favored trade status, something worth the lives of US military personnel lost and maimed while protection your ~sovreignity~ from your neighbors.
No, it is definitely welfare in its purest form. Shoring up other nations’ stability at the expense of the American taxpayer, and the American taxpayer is the last one to reap any true, worthwhile benefit.
We should be shoring up and stabilizing our own borders, citizens, and economy before we decide to adopt the problems of the rest of the world.
An isolationist ideal? It’s long overdue that other nations grow the hell up and start taking more of their own responsibilities for their own existence.

Amen Mike! I wonder what this would all be like if they put Congress on a GS-07 salary just for fun? I don’t waste money on luxuries and I have to put into a retirement fund just like everyone else in the country (IF they want to retire with something to show for it). My kids go to public schools and my husband and I carpool to work every day just to save some money on gas. I have been married for 14 years and in that time have not ONCE been able to afford to take a family vacation. Why must government employees AND military suffer when the ones who are making the rules aren’t punished AT ALL for their actions? Not FAIR and Not RIGHT! I’m not asking to be “safe” from the pain…others just need to realize that we are ALWAYS in pain financially and, unlike them, we HAVE to have good credit and keep debt down in our households in order to hold on to the jobs that we have. It’s no fun to be vilified for doing the very best you can for yourself and your family while doing the best that you can with the limited resources you’re given at work to try to make your country a safer place. God Bless AMERICA!!!

The 2007 Defense Authorization Act changed how Active Duty Retirement Pay is calculated. Prior to 2007 retirement pay was capped at 75 percent of the individual’s base pay. At that time if someone served 30 years or more they received retirement pay at 75 percent of their base pay. The 2007 Defense Authorization Act added 2.5 percent for each year beyond 30; which could result in, and has resulted in, an individual collecting more than their base pay when they retire. A USA Today “Some top military brass making more in pension than pay”-3 Feb 2012, has pointed out that there are “146 three-star officers and 44 four-star officers” who receive more in retirement than they made on active duty. According to the article there is a 4-star general who retired with 43 years of service and is collecting over $272,000 a year, whereas the top pay for an active-duty officer is capped at $179,900 and the typical retirement for a 4-star prior to 2007 was $134,400. There is a common theme when ever budget cuts are necessary and when talking where the cuts must come from and that theme is cut/lay off/furlough/freeze pay rate of government employees. Why must the government employee be the scapegoat? Why not repeal the 2007 Defense Authorization Act, stop giving grants for unnecessary research, stop paying for programs that don’t work, stop paying former Congress persons six figure retirement pay for only serving a few years in office and stop sending money overseas. We (government employees) have families to feed and clothe just like everyone else and I bet the money spent paying government employees is a fraction of the National debt. It is easy for everyone to point their figures at us but if the shoe was on the other foot I bet they wouldn’t be so quick to point.

I am a single father with two kids and a mortgage on a very small townhouse. With the increasing health insurance costs, auto insurance, dental insurance and vision insurance for my family, and other deductions; my deductions are 50% of my income. I have to keep this insurance because I couldn’t afford to pay out of pocket to keep my family healthy.. I am budgeted to the max as it is. This 20% pay reduction will cause an alarming amount of defaults on auto loans, mortgages.…etc. It makes me sick to think that people that serve one elected position in congress making well over $150K a year, get to retire from one term and keep collecting money. Ask yourself, are they looking at what is really in the countries best interests? Spending does need to be cut, but there comes a time were you have to look at the damage that pushing it onto the workforce creates.

The people paying $60 a month to live in large government funded section 8 houses is our real problem. The same people that qualify for government funded programs for medical assistance. These are the same people that are buying steaks to feed there pets because wellfare will not cover dog food. The Department of Defense employes have an extremely tough job for minimal pay and cannot qualify for the programs that our taxes are being used to pay for. You sound very ignorant in your comment. P.S. the average internal raise for the DoD is $0.09 an hour. How is that saving money to deny people there right to work hard and improve there quality of living?

Do you think these furloughs will only be for this fiscal year? Think again, this is a 10 year program people.

I disagree with your view and for you to put all govt employees in one category…well just about shows your ignorance. I am a government employee (prior military) and use my time picking up the pieces of over-worked active duty members. Budget cuts need to be reconfigured especially considering anyone who has witnessed the ridiculous spenditures of end of year. I do not “rake in the money” by any stretch of the imagination but being realistic waste is everywhere.

Can you use vacation time during the furlough?

I am a retiree and also a DOD employee in a term position. I hope it doesn’t come to this, but if it does, I hope they are wose enought to make good deciisons. Probably not, but only time will tell. We do spend toons of money on projects that are never going to get off the ground. Think about if we didn’t try to advance our technology and other coutries did and succeeded. We can make better cuts in other areas and support the US instead of all of these other coutires who only like the US when we are sending them money. How about all the money we spend on welfare instead of creating and making people that abuse the system work or lose benefits. With all the increases in costs and decreases in benefits, I might be better off on welfare.

No.

Forgot to mention that you cannot take annual/sick leave during a furlough and that is per the Antideficiency Act (31 USC 1341 et seq.),

completely agree

I for one don’t like having to take a day off without pay, but fair is fair. What about the folks in the civilian populous. When it comes to having to take days off without pay, let the civilians that don’t work for the government, have their pay docked as well. Then of course you have the President and his cabinet, congress and the senate, dock their pay. If we are going to have the give up a day of pay each week, then lets spread the wealth around the whole United States. Tthis should include all the illegal aliens, most of which pay no taxes at all, but reap all the benefits of welfare as well as social security. Some are here having baby after baby and who is paying for them, we the American people. If you take it from employers that are hiring these folks then I am sure they would not hesitate to do the same for these aliens..

not at this time, unless specific circumstances(like scheduled use/lose at the end of the calendar year), but even fewer apply to the time period April to September. Get working on a plan, let’s continue being Americans and making it work. If you have post 9–11 gi bill, you may want to check out education in your day off. There are opportunities out there… I’d like to be able to take it all at once too!

–K

Because they can then draw unemployment. But remember that congress and the president are not giving up anything. They also got pay raises! Go figure that one out.

I must ask if your are a Veteran commoncents? If you are or know any you know the VA is overworked and underpaid. WE ARE the middle class too yet we have been paying the bill for the last two plus years.

If you think we don’t do anything, let’s see what happens when we’re gone. That’s an ignorant statement. I’m retired Military and love that I can still support troops. As a civilian your responsibilities are different than uniformed members. You’re entitled to your opinion. Have a Great Day!

One day on, one day off. for six months that should help. Its a simple solution. If that dont help, Then go for another one day off. one day on for another six.Keep things going by alternating the bodies.With all those high paid bodies, It shouldnt take long to get caught up on the debt.

Sorry joe, I am not highly paid. And loosing 4days pay every month for six months is going too be tough on my family

Why don’t you except the President for who he’s. Federal employees already given up 2 yrs of our pay increase. To keep my job and feed my family I’m willing to give up two days. How many days are you will to give up?

I’m going to Obama’s house to live, he should have room for all of us, just think, no electric, gas, water, car insurance, no grocery shopping, no grass to be cut, no cleaning period…smile

I agree with Diana, losing 4 days pay a month will be tough on the family as well.….I’m not highly paid either. We work hard to support our troops and this is what they do to us? This can only hurt people’s motivation because they work hard to support their country only to see the government care more about foreign aid than their own American workers.

Why can’t we suspend foreign aid for 6 months and pay our hard working Americans????????

Commoncents — you’re an idiot. If you don’t like our American constitutional system of government and the people who work for it, I would be delighted to buy you a one way ticket to some truly God-awful countries where they share you lack of respect for anything decent in the world. How about Mali, Syria, Egypt, just to cite three?

The amount of ignorance on display with this comment is staggering.

Maybe not but for illegals in the south who work in the fields and they have their bosses GIVING them NEW vehicles to drive around, and furnishing a place to live with furniture. I am sure whatever funds if even a small amount is enough to pay for food. And on top of that if illegal residents have such a hard time getting assistance ( which they don’t) how come they have no problem getting their children into school without documentation ( you still have to provide proof of residency for the parent which is usually not in their name), or going to the hospital once again without documentation or even adults getting a degree? ( which I have seen first hand) I personally have known illegal residents who receive aid from the government so you can all stop with the lying about how you don’t get decent jobs or benefits. If working at a maufacturing plant in the U.S. making $10 plus dollars an hour or a nuclear power plant making $18 an hour then explain to me what you expect to be getting for just crossing a border when there are some people with bachelors degrees who were born here and worked really hard coming from being near homeless or who may have even been homeless and followed the law and tell me why they are resorted to working at McDonalds when they can’t get hired in a field because the color of their skin? The main thing illegals usually resort to is saying that they take the jobs that Americans don’t want. Really?! If it feeds my kids and provides a roof I don’t mind scrubbing toilets or cleaning up barf or even wiping a strangers ASS. The outsourcing of the jobs in this country is horrible you have foreign people coming to be doctors and nurses ( contracted) but their residency is still under Visa they only come for the money to leave and take it back to their country. They don’t normally attempt to even become a citizen. That is a lot of money that is leaving our country everyday. You would think with America being so grateful to take the food of their natives tables and hand it out to the illegals the illegals would be a little more grateful to at least try to stimulate our economy but no they are more of a theif than a pity me sob story.

Why not reduce the house and senate … probably save enough money to bale out Europe.

I say get rid of the civilians and save more billions that the military can spend on troops that actually go to war. These desk jockies are a waste of funds. You can’t fire them if they are poor performers since they have unions and they have more rights than the military members that work with them or for them. Why do we need civilians taking jobs that military members can hold?

I am really trying to understand some of you about your “Federal Employee Benefit” statements. I retired after 20yrs a took a large paycut that with my retirement…is several thousand short of what I got as a TSGT. Plus, now paying medical, dental, and vision. Oh, I also get to pay life insurance at an inflated rate. This is only a fraction of increases I now must pay for outside the military. Due to the economy, I should be getting GS-12 and not GS-08, but sacrafices are made to try to live. I don’t get perks at my job and perform shift work 24/7. Base closed due to snow — not us — we have to be there. If the right people took the right cuts then some of us might not have to work for free. If contractors didn’t over-charge the gov’t, then it would be cheaper. I could of saved the Air Force millions, but when you have to go through your contractor…that amount now is 4 to 5 times more.

Thanks for stating that. I’m a GS-07 and I certainly am not living high on the hog. While I know I am fortunate/blessed to have a job, I certainly don’t live the lifestyle that the public thinks we all do. Thanks to wage freezes for the last few years, my kids now qualify for reduced lunches at school, we get fuel assistance, and I get a small bit of the earned income credit every year. My one vehicle is 10 years old. Social security withholding just went up, so that’s another chunk that’s gone every two weeks. Every time our health insurance premium creeps up, or our copays go up, that’s a little more we have to tighten the belt.

How much has been spent on spy drones to spy on us citizens?????????

Speaking from the Air Force side, what do you expect us to fly? Ships? You are correct in that something has to give. I suggest we clean up Capitol Hill than we can move forward.

Great Answer! That would be the most logical place to begin.

Let’s mint some bazillion dollar coins! Yeah…that’s the ticket. Bazinga!

It isn’t the President doing this. it is Congress (the opposite of progress) doing this. Incumbent is a 4-letter word for me.

Cut the number of trips that Obama takes with Air Force 1 and that alone can eradicate the budget issue for the military. Talk about waste, fraud and abuse!

The only problem is that little people as myself that’s being working for DOD, since 1985 will be hurt !
Furloughing us by no means stop the foolish spending on projects like F-35. Our checks have alrady been cut effectvie 1 jan 13 OASID,

Yeah, that’s one issue that irks thousands of federal employees who AREN’T leadership-level attached: we get a two-year freeze on cost-of-living raises (unless a scheduled Step increase), yet the top tier leaders of the nation certainly don’t.

This is where it needs to be
a), an across-the-board, fixed-percentage where every federal employee (and even at state level at states’ discretion) gets the same cost-of-living yearly increase percentage (fixed, across-the-board percentage, NOT COLA based) or NO ONE gets it, PERIOD.

or b), Presidential, Congressional, and Supreme Court raises are made voter-decided, put on national ballot for taxpayers to decide that our leaders are truly worthy of a so-called ~performance based~ pay increase.
Also mandate the same fair and balanced insurance benefits: make copays and out-of-pocket payments percentage-based on overall salary. The POTUS or my Congressman/woman should not be ~entitled~ to a lifetime of free (or very cheap) health care when so many taxpayers who put them in office have to struggle for theirs.

Dave — I’m glad to see that I’m not the only Fed that feels a 20% cut would really hurt me and my family. We haven’t had a raise in years, bills are going up, and now, our “secure” jobs are giving us a vacation without pay. This is a genuine concern.…..

I live on a GS7 salary and with most of my paycheck going to deductions, it is not easy.……

It is actually an 8.5% pay cut. It amounts to 22 non-continuous days. In any given year, there are an average of 257 work days. 20% would be 51 days.

That would make too much sense! Our politicians don’t care about who they give te taxpayer’s money too as long as THEY look good and keep the American taxpayer under their thumbs…where is their AUTHORITY to give our money away? the constitution affords the federal government the right to tax in support of this countries operation not to kiss the muslim’s asses.

So, as I plan ahead of the game, I do not have enough time to protect my life from the last two times the government decided to take my hard earned mony. So I get to drain my fund for a house of my own, emergencies, vacations are out the window, and I have to stop adding to my childrens college fund. This is all because I do not have enough time to prepair for the pay cuts that I should be thankful for because I am a lazy American who defended her country, stood by the husband who defended his country, while raising 3 children (by the way, it was the expired birth control from a military hospital that gave us our third), working full time and going to college. Instead of cuting the pay of those who have not seen a raise in years, lets cut the pay of those who want to argue about our fate and work less days then my children go to school a year. If we cut their pay until we, as a country, is fixed from 6 figures a year to 5 figures a year, maybe they wont be so LAZY

It is this type of mentality that creates chaos and discontent in our services. As a Vietnam Vet, and a civil servant with over 30 years working for our Air Force, I find your comment objectionable. It is the stability of the civil service employee that helps keeps our warfighters prepared. All too often, I have seen our military counterparts come in for two years, change everything, then leave. The next officer comes in, makes changes and then leaves. They are here only to “fill the holes” in their career sheets for promotion. In my career I have seen major changes take place, only to see the next guy come in and change everything back. As well, at times I have worked side-by-side with military counterparts. And, to be quite honest, due to all the military happenings (PT, training, commander’s calls, etc.) they are typically only here a very few hours per day. (cont…)

(Continued…)
C’mon now. Get real. We need the balance of the mobile workforce AND the stability of a constant, task related, working group. I am a dedicated Air Force civilian employee. ( …probably more dedicated to the warfighter effort than I was when I was a GI during Viet Nam). I resent your remarks.
–GS-12, Computer Software Programmer/Analyst –USAF

I totally agree with you. I am also a Veteran and now work for the US Government. Money funneled overseas usually ends up in the coffers of some dictator anyway. Remember all the huge piles of money that was found when we toppled Saddam Hussein’s regime? Where do you think all those hundred dollar bills came from? They came from us, the American taxpayer! Considering the financial situation we are currently experiencing,

I think it is time that we, as a People, put our feet down and demand that ALL US taxpayer money be used EXCLUSIVELY for American projects. Cutting off welfare to many of those now receiving it would also be beneficial. I was unemployed for about 2 years a decade or so ago, and NOBODY ever gave ME any free taxpayer money. I couldn’t even get a low cost student loan to continue my college education. I was told by a woman at the financial aid office at the college that I “made too much money” to qualify for the low cost student loan program — how, I asked her, can I be making too much money when I have no income what so ever? She said that if I could afford to pay rent, I could afford to pay for my college expenses. I informed her that my parents had loaned me some $$ to help pay for basic living expenses, and she replied, “well, you should get THEM to pay for my schooling as well”.

Why make cuts from those that work PERIOD. It is so easy to quit and have everything handed to you…WIC, Welfaree, housing, food stamps. It is ridiculous. How about pay one person in each county to investigate those people, put a limit, and quit making it so damn easy to get!

We have several problems that need immediate attention:
1. Cut all foreign aid immediately.
2. Stop ALL illegal immigration and severely punish anyone who employs illegal immigrants.
3. Remove EVERYONE that is physically able to do some type of constructive work from the Welfare rolls or, make them show up at their local town “square” EVERY day and put them to work cleaning up roadside ditches and doing other busy work so that they will have at least SOME incentive to return to the normal workforce.

Paying some low-life to lay back and produce endless numbers of kids for their entire life is just down right STUPID! I can understand that rough times can befall anyone, but spending a lifetime on the American taxpayer’s “dime” should NOT even be an option. I think we should cut back the welfare and instead, use that money to help support the REAL needy folks who have tried to be gainfully employed instead of just handing the money out to people who have not earned it. So what if those “dependant” welfare receipients are forced to work at some crappy job somewhere? Hell, I’ve cleaned crappers at the local truckstop for minimum wage before, when I had to, so why can’t these folks do the same?

Your English grammar skills are horrible “legend”. It’s extremely expensive to live in the United States and now Congress is cutting Federal Employee pay by 20% while they reap the benefits. We, the People, should vote out Congress and the House. Who needs them anyway? All they do is argue.

mike. I agree 10000000 %. im a gs 02 they need to cut congress and the rest of white house salary not a pay raise

U going on welfare?

You don’t check your facts??? The US is ready to forgive another $1Bill debt to egypt and DID forgive $7Bill during Desert Storm. That’s just one country and what about the DOS giving $800Mill for renovation and repairs of mosque??? Not to mention all that we give to the UN.…where do you believe that money comes from?? Oh yeah it’s ubama’s money right?

I agree. I started as a GS-02 in 1985. I worked my way up to a GS-09, but it took 15 years. I’ve been stuck at GS-09 for 13 years. I’m grateful for my job, but I am still struggling financially. I have two boys to raise with only one car with over 139,000 miles on it. I cannot afford to fix anything in my house nor purchase a new car. What gives???

Well, if you get rid of all the “desk jockeys”, who do you think is going to process your tax return check? Oh, you probably don’t get a refund, as you are most likely one of those leeches who are sucking on the taxpayer’s titties! I agree that there ARE positions that could & should be done away with, but there are also MANY positions that are critical. Perhaps you should concentrate your attention on smething that you are familiar with — like sitting around smoking dope and drinking beer at the taxpayer’s expense!

Joe, you are sadly mis-informed. BTW, if that “doesn’t” work.… your grammar is what’s really “off”.

What more can I say Tom, “You’re a jerk with poor grammar”. You should be using the word “who” not that. My IQ is 143 and I’m a Federal Employee. Imagine that.….I also speak 6 languages. How many do you speak?

We keep saying “how little this is, how little that is” when we refer to different financial situations as a remedy. The last time I looked 1+1 stilled equaled 2. Therefore, if you put enough 1%s in the bucket your bucket is going to get fuller. Tell me, why did Mr. Obama need ANOTHER inaugeration party???? Isn’t his happy butt already there? How much did that cost? Did he pay for it? That would be another little “plinck” in the bucket that would have been nice to see. We have to stop put out for so many things!! And getting off the money to those who pay taxes that they want DOES NOT heal a thing. It makes it worse. We would save a lot more money cutting off the money to other countries that trying to starve out our own people. How much is going to Egypt? How much money didn’t collect from all the countries in World War II that still owes us today?? PLINCK, PLINCK, PLINCK!!

We keep saying “how little this is, how little that is” when we refer to different financial situations as a remedy. The last time I looked 1+1 stilled equaled 2. Therefore, if you put enough 1%s in the bucket your bucket is going to get fuller. Tell me, why did Mr. Obama need ANOTHER inaugeration party???? Isn’t his happy butt already there? How much did that cost? Did he pay for it? That would be another little “plinck” in the bucket that would have been nice to see. We have to stop put out for so many things!! And getting off the money to those who pay taxes that they want DOES NOT heal a thing. It makes it worse. We would save a lot more money cutting off the money to other countries that trying to starve out our own people. How much is going to Egypt? How much money didn’t collect from all the countries in World War II that still owes us today?? PLINCK, PLINCK, PLINCK!!

There is an inauguration party every time a new term occurs, it doesn’t matter who it is getting the party. Bush and Reagan from the republicans, and Clinton and Obama from the Democrats all got 2 parties. And you realize that the point isn’t that getting 100 1% cuts would fill the bucket so to speak, but that it gives a huge return on our investment, as it supports so much but costs relatively so little. This is the point in all foreign aid, it’s for international PR.

Ding Ding Ding. This is why blanket cuts are bad, because they’ll just cut payroll instead of pet projects.

Seems simple, but the president has to make meetings all over the world. Air force one isn’t more expensive than any other VIP plane, and the cost of missing meetings is far more than the cost of travel. Remember, there has been a Air Force One since there has been an air force.

Its frustrating to know theres bad stuff coming our way and theres absolutely nothing any of us can do about it except pray our elected leadership can pull their heads out of their !@#$% and work together for the American people. Write your Congressman, your Senators, and the President! Send them an email from their web page. Takes a few minutes to fill out the information. Their addresses can be found at http://​www​.usa​.gov. Who knows if it will do any good, but it sure made me feel better after venting. I sent the same email to my Congressman, both our state Senators (one republican, one democrat) and the President. Got replies from the republicans and silence from the dems. I am an independent!! My opinion does not mean much to most, but based on their performance, cuts should start at the top 50% of the highest paid earners all the way up to and including the President.

I agree with SD-Emply. DoD civilian employees are being forced to take these cuts. What about military contractors? They cost more than civilians. If DoD really wants to reduce cost, they need to make sure they cut back on both. Don’t reduce the number of civilians and replace them with contractors because the mission/function doesn’t go away. The mission/functions must stop and DoD and the American tax player must understand the US is taking risk in these areas.

But for the weeks I’m furloughed, my pay will be 20% less. Granted, the annualized amount isn’t 20%, but the impact to my monthly budget from April through the end of the FY is a 20% reduction. If it were spread out over the full FY, it wouldn’t hit so hard on the monthly numbers. Or if we knew it was coming from the beginning for the FY and were able to plan accordingly, it wouldn’t be as much of a hit psychologically. In my command all the civilians will experience this hit while our uniformed colleagues received annual pay increase and no cost cutting furloughs — their biggest complaint is no more travel. Funny how travel that was so “necessary” a couple of months ago and required a whole team of them to visit another command can now be accomplished over the phone. Yes, let’s cut the fat, but hitting the federal civilians yet again isn’t going to get us where we need to be. I also agree that if furloughed, let employees take it in one chunk if they choose.…. but then I suppose it would result in a reduction in productivity. Duh. What good is the action if the consequences — both good and bad — aren’t experienced?

Before that, they used a cruiser, and cruisers are more expensive than an jet.

This makes me so happy! all you big mouths crying about a pay cut! No problem when old GW pumped up the budget to inflate the military with overpaid civilian workers, and now waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!! I want more money.….. As if you didnt know it was coming.

The HELL with it ALL, the bastards is going to do what they want to anyway.….…__GOD is in CONTROL..HOLLOA

exactly david!!

I agree with the other posters. I am a civilian and I don’t sit all day and do nothing. I work for recruiting — we put people in the service. We are always busy. Our TDY budget has pretty much been axed — so there are not rooms full of us sleeping raking in per diem. No — we now utilize VTC’s and conference calls on a daily basis. Don’t generalize your comments about government workers. The reason there are more civilians than contractors is that the govt found out it is cheaper to employ civilians as opposed to contractors and a lot of contract positions were deleted.

Not all civilians belong to unions. We are usually the first place they start cutting. Thre is currently a DOD hiring freeze. Our units TDY has pretty much been eleiminated and oh, BTW we civilians have not gotten a COLA for each of the last 4 years (so our pay is not keeping up with inflation). So now they want to furlough us for up to 22 days (an entire months pay is what it amounts to — 1/12 of our salary). With my job specialty I could have taken a private sector job for maybe $20K more a year — but since I had a number of years in — I decided to stay until retirement — and this is how we get treated. I have 27 years in with DOD and of those only 4 years have not received a COLA — thank you Mr President — NOT!

I agree completely, I’m in the exact same boat.

Immediately suspend Congress’s and the President’s pay, both parties, until they can pass a budget and start taking serious steps to cut our debt. If people realized how really bad our debt situation is and how close we are to an economic collapse, then something would be done.
Here’s some help for you politicians:
Bring ALL of our military home from Europe, Afghanistan, Iraq, Japan, Korea, etc., and make all those countries pay us for the protection we’ve provided them over the years. Do away with Welfare, Dept. of Education, Dept. of Energy, Dept. of HS, IRS, Benefits for illegals, and Ethanol. Also do away with 0bamacare and let the States take care of their own people, that’s not the job of the Fed Govt.
This will not do away with our Debt but it is a great start and will have an impact.

Desk Jockey??? Are you fricken kidding me??? I was hired by the Navy to “save” money. My military counterpart makes $20K more per year than I do. I do about 4 times his workload too. I’m a little GS6 with GS12 responsibilities. I bring stability and logic to this command. I run the supply office, safety, and all of the facilities. My paycheck has gone down every year due to increasing healthcare costs, payroll taxes and the like. I completely RESENT your statement! I work extremely hard at my job with little pay. I took this job to get my foot in the door for highing paying jobs via the government since I’m 5 years of prior active duty. I’ve been here over 5 years now…and yes, am still here! I love working with the military…but trust me, we civilians have NO EXTRA PERKS!! We’re treated as “sub standard” employees at times — depending upon the mentality of our current skippers.

Are you going to cut the amount that a person gets for welfare? Why is the working man always the one that has to pay? We have to eat and pay bills also.

You don’t pay attention as many government employees and I would say most do their duty to save and spend intelligently. As for government employees sleeping, you obviously don’t with government and have no idea what’s it’s like. You’re just a rumor mongorer.

people — you had all better wake up !!!! all this is part of a plan by ” the new worl order” you can forget about jobs , cars. electricty, we better learn to survive off the land and by the way number one read your bible

I am the type of person that see’s the merit in two sides of an arguement. and I agree with the majority of the posts here, with some exceptions. I’m a DOD dual-status technician, hence also a member of the National Guard. The GS level employees where I work are, for the most part, industrious, hard-working employees. Ther are exceptions, as in any workplace. But I’ve never been in a work environment so endowed with inexperienced ineffectual supervision. My supervisor, an WS-12, plays video games and sirfs the net ALL day. But the real point is, that American’s had the opportunity in Nov to elect a pro-business, pro-defense candidate and they did not, even though they had the numbers to do so. They didn’t vote…the Democrats di, with a weel managed, targeted voter approach and now, you got what you got. Federal workers remember this in 2016..

let’s start with your job next time your awake.

Such a narrowed and uninformed way of thinking! The budget and the economy started going down hill years before this president even arrived at our door step. But the congress and the house have been here for even longer.

so do all you who think the federal government workers earn too much and should lose pay, after not having received a pay raise in over three years, have a solution to the dip in the economy that is going to occur? some people won’t be able to pay their bills, let alone shop for extras. will they get a break to keep from losing their homes when they can’t make their mortgage payments? I agree we should cut the fat at the top, way too many chiefs and not enough workers. but what about the lower paid employees? what are all the laid off workers going to do? collect unemployment or welfare. who is going to pay for that? oh, again, me and the rest of the working people. why don’t we stop paying our representatives until they pass a budget?
cut the military? remember them? those out there protecting our butts. how are they going to live without a job and no money? again, unemployment and/or welfare. Why is the working man always the one that has to pay? We have to eat and pay bills too. let’s stop giving away money to foreign countries and take care of our own.

GS-07 ? how many could meet the requirements? Since we thankless jobs let’s return the favor, GS-03 General Housekeeping. The way they keep their house after making fully successful (which is doubtful) and get tossed out (voted out) let’s see how they like retirement on their high three yrs. Bet that women congressman in Colorado would not be talking about highest five. Funny the Orwellian theory of equality we live by in this country.

I know you mean well, but it’s unrealistic. You want us to tell the staff leave your patients, drop your clinical studies, and we’ve waited for cures a long time so let’s put research and pandemic outbreaks on the back burner. Just because we might score 5billion. HHS employee, would love to hear from the 27 institutes who we house here at NIH.

Yada yada yada…I hear about the coming pandemics all the time, bird flu, swine flu, SARS and on and on. You don’t have a cure and you’re not even close to having one. In fact when has NIH ever found a cure for anything? The 27 institutes at NIH and all of HHS would be high on my target list.
The federal government’s ONLY constitutional responsibility is national defence. It has NO BUSINESS in the health care business.
You seem to be trying to justify your, and your fellow federal employees high priced jobs.

A furlough day isn’t the same as an unpaid vacation. It mean’s they’re working a full 8 hour day, but not getting paid for it.

HE must be a contractor

Tom, I wish you would try to do my job. You would be fired in a week. Very few folks in the private sector would entertain deploying, or donning chem gear side by side with the active duty in a remote country around the world. Bottom-line DOD civilians get it done

Your wrong.

Why do people have children when they cant afford them????

Actually, if you look at the OPM guidelines, if you so choose, you can indeed take leave without pay under FMLA and have it count towards a 30 day furlough.

I agree with this statement. I am so sick of women living off taxpayers and being baby machines.
They are not worth the air they breath

“Maybe not but for illegals in the south who work in the fields and they have their bosses GIVING them NEW vehicles to drive around, and furnishing a place to live with furniture.”

So how does the government figure into this?

“The outsourcing of the jobs in this country is horrible you have foreign people coming to be doctors and nurses ( contracted) but their residency is still under Visa they only come for the money to leave and take it back to their country. They don’t normally attempt to even become a citizen. That is a lot of money that is leaving our country everyday. ”

Yup, but our “illegal immigration” stance is “don’t let them have babies in America”, and is focused on preventing illegal immigrants from settling here. People going in and leaving seems to be praised. That said, most people who go through graduate or professional school tend to have better opportunities here and –stay-. People who have nothing also have nothing to return to and also –stay-.

“The main thing illegals usually resort to is saying that they take the jobs that Americans don’t want. Really?! If it feeds my kids and provides a roof I don’t mind scrubbing toilets or cleaning up barf or even wiping a strangers ASS.”

I think it depends on prevailing wage. There are plenty of Americans working as janitors out there, and the argument of Americans refusing to do it is a little out there. Many immigrants work in meatpacking plants, day laborers or in agribusiness for the most part. For the first, the idea of getting autoimmune brain disorders from inhaling aerosolized animal brain is not in my cards. The second is vaguely tolerable, though the demise of the housing bubble has eliminated a lot of the surplus labor demand.

” I am so sick of women living off taxpayers and being baby machines”

Waiting for the Fetal Incubator so the Y chromosome can inherit the earth…?

dear dave please come out of the bunker or at least let the kid go.

I say to you! I served this great nation for 20 years in combat boots,Why dont you put the boots on and then come home and get a job with the goverment and see how you feel. If you dont know anything about it keep you opinions too yourself.A.H

TOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The thing that bothers me about the cuts is that due to rules, regulations & unions, no one will actually be making the cuts where it would be most efficient. I know many good DoD workers whoe all have many examples of workers who do almost nothing, but can’t be fired because it’s almost impossible to fire anyone. A good friend worked several years with a worker so incompetent that it actually took more of the other workers time to try to help her do her job than it would have for them to do the work themselves. She was heavily involved with the union and instead of firing her she was just shuffled from one job to another. So instead of firing employees like her, all the good employes will be expected to do more work in less time. I expect if logic & competence were allowed to make the decisions, most DoD could cut 20% out of their budget with no reduction in performance. Unfortunately that probably won’t happen.

lol

It is difficult to understand your point; your syntax and grammar are so abysmal. How are we lazy American(s) if we work for the federal government and don’t want to stay home? Although it is unclear just what your point is, you appear to feel government workers are also greedy, money grubbing types who deserve what may happen. Being “smart” (as you apparently are, as evidenced by your post), and advising planning ahead is certainly good advice, but let’s face it: we have been on a roller coaster with the budget for years, and it has been hard to put away extra funds in the light of the recession and loss of not only pay raises, but step increases also. In my household, I have also taken cuts in pay and benefits, which complicates the advice to plan ahead. It is hard to plan when the game is ever changing.
Finally, I am not sure what you mean by it being my “false” as this modifier is not attached to any thing or idea. Did you mean “fault” instead?
As for your post:
Is there only one lazy American? Or did you mean lazy Americans, because you later reference “their ass” which would indicate a plurality, and since “ass” is singular, does that refer to joint ownership of that derriere?
It is common usage to capitalize the proper pronoun “I” and is taught in the lower grades of elementary school.
It is also common practice to start the first word of a sentence with a capital (also taught in lower grades).
Clarity of thought and writing are important in conveying ideas to others. Your post lacks both.

What needs to go is the fat LQA paychecks that they collect over here in Europe, i.e. rent and utilities paid completely paid for monsterous homes they could never afford in the states! Do away with that, make everyone pay their own rent and utilities and there is your billions of dollars well saved. I am able to pay my own rent and utilities on GS-5 pay which is less than $30K a year.

it’s DEFENSE. Another brainiac with great “ideas”

this irks me when foreigners can come to this country, start business with no tax and then buy homes, live well, and even doing so well they are selling their current home and buying a 500K home because their business is so lucrative and they didn’t have to pay tax, but we Americans are struggling. The foreigners I am referring to are someone I know and yes they are very wealthy now

Oronguy27, it doesn’t matter who’s in office, we still going though hard times. The president is not the worst or the best ever. Go back in time and tell me who was bad or good as the presidents. Instead of everyone fighting about this; or that how about congresses do their job along with the president. I’m hurting all the way around, I have a house, car and I drive 90 miles a day to work and I’m a GS-7. I may lose my house, could lose my car etc; I don’t like whats going on in either parties, I wish they could see that they are hurting the little people and we do matter.

It is the tax payers house… we all pay for it!!!

yessssssssssssssssssssssssss..

Really??? Furloughs? Why don’t we start with over 30 years of paying foreign countries twice the rent of the value of their properties?? Our government has been paying landlords in foreign countries where troops are stationed, twice the rent..essentially paying for houses in foreign countries with taxpayer dollars!!! If we would pay fair market value for renting houses on the economy, we could solve part of the fiscal problem. This should be considered WAY before a furlough. Can people really afford to lose 20% of their paycheck for 6 months??

As a govt. employee your full of BS. All of the people I work with, including myself, are hard working and dedicated public servants. Where do you get the opinion that all civil service workers don’t do anything?
Are you one of them? We try to save as much in our budgets as we can. We are very good at it, too. I bet
you have done the same thing. Stop being a hypocrite and sanctimonious. Get to work…

How about each senator and congressman give 1 year of their pension back to the government? Where else can you work for a 4 year term and have benefits and retirement? That is the biggest waste ever! If they were actually working for the interest of the American citizen, they would leave after their 4 year term and get a job like the rest of us, who put them there in the first place! We need to rise up and protect our own country, because rather than them actually DO that, they serve their own interests! Give up some of those benefits and leave the DoD alone, so American can stay a protected and free nation!

I am in complete agreement! I think it’s time that we, who voted those schmucks in office to begin with, stand up for our country. They obviously don’t!

We have too many programs that are nothing but pork, providing kickbacks to those who already are paid until their death, while our vets are having to go out and get food stamps, welfare, and second and third jobs to make ends meet or have insurance.

People are themselves making crisis! God didn’t make crisis. And later they are crying! Better they just would listen Crowded House and then will forget anything!

The sad part is that even if an agency can absorb their cuts from non-pay areas, the decision has been made from on high, OPM, that agencies WILL furlough, with few exceptions, EVERY employee for up to 22 days. This is even nuttier than the “sky is falling” mantra we have been hearing for years and years. If a Fed. agency has to absorb an estimated (just for illustration) $100B and the agency has determined that this can be done without derailing employee lives.…they can’t use this plan.…they MUST furlough the people. Rather than let an agency determine where to take the hits…once again our ‘employees’ in Congress have determined that we may have good sense to elect them, but we now can’t think our way out of a paper bag when it comes to real dollar and cents. Shame on them, and shame on those who voted them into place.

I tire of people who seem to think that Government employees do not do anything and think that by cutting the number of Government employees it will help with the issue at hand. I wish these people would do their research before making those types of comments. Take for example the article published by The Heritage Foundation title Federal Spending by the Numbers – 2012-October 16, 2012. In this article the author, Alison Acosta Fraser (Dir., Thomas A. Roe Institute for Economic Policy Studies), has clearly outlined the differences in spending between the different programs and compared that spending to the 2002 numbers. Defense spending is up 49.5% from the 2002 numbers but likely it is because of the money spent to fund the war in Afghanistan and Iraq and the cost associated with rebuilding those two countries (my guess not the articles statement). However, there are several other programs that are up equal to or greater than that amount. For example, “MEDICARE is up 70.3%; Transportation up 61.0%; Food Stamps and Other Nutrition up 136.5%; International Affairs up 95.1%”, just to name a few. Additionally, according to the article “Sequestration imposes 50 percent of its reductions on defense, which represents only 17 percent of federal spending in 2013 “; whereas, “Mandatory spending accounts for 64 percent of the budget in 2013, but receives only 15 percent of the sequestration cuts.” I have been trying to find what “Mandatory spending” consist of but have been unsuccessful. Bottom line, I am tired of stressing over how I am going to take care of my family when I lose 16 hours of pay for those months and the fact that costs for nearly everything have gone up since 2010 but I am still getting paid 2010 pay rate. I have said this before and I will continue to say it until I am blue in the face; there are two very important lessons I learned while serving in the military, first, always lead from the front-never the back, and second, never ask anything of my subordinates I myself am not willing to do. I think it is about time our leadership in Congress and the White House commit to those same values and beliefs and start sacrificing at their level before they MAKE us sacrifice. After all I would venture to guess they could afford it more so than I. Another interesting article posted on The Foundry is title Members of Congress Earn Big Salaries and Fringe Benefits –July 29, 2011. In the article the author, Mike Brownfield, reports that Congressional leaders make upwards of $174,000 annually and can receive upwards of “$110,000 in taxpayer-funded fringe benefits.” There are a couple of really good hyperlinks in this article that can be accessed which breaks down the fringe benefits. References: The Heritage Foundation, Federal Spending by the Numbers – 2012, October 2012, http://​www​.heritage​.org/​r​e​s​e​a​r​c​h​/​r​e​p​o​r​t​s​/​2​0​1​2​/​10/… (accessed February 11, 2013) and The Foundry, Members of Congress Earn Big Salaries and Fringe Benefits, July, 2011, http://​blog​.heritage​.org/​2​0​1​1​/​0​7​/​2​9​/​m​e​m​b​e​r​s​-​o​f​-co… (accessed February 11, 2013).

hahayoubabies:
I’ve worked as a civilian for almost 31 years. I’m a Vietnam Vet. where I was a crew chief on a Huey gunship. Today I modify live Ejection Seats and when I’m not doing that I’m working with F-16 engineers on instituting preliminary modifications at a base in the western U.S. I just filed my income taxes and my adjusted income was less than $37K. I’m required to have a working knowledge of the A-10, F-16 and C-130 weapons systems while running a structural support shop. At what point do you believe I am being over paid?

Many of the positions currently being performed by civilians belonged to Soldiers. Civilians were hired in an effort to free the Soldier to perform combat duties in the field. Soldiers are not returning; thus, those civilians are no longer needed. So — the civilians are crying now, but should we unemploy those who sacrificed the most by defending this nation over those who sat back in cushy offices while stifling many processes due to their incompentence? I say not… You’ve had your fat free checks, now go an do other things or rejoin the uniformed services.

John Doe — SHAME ON YOU! Do you realize that the MAJORITY of the federal workforce fall well below the 50K a year salary? Do you check your facts before posting? Contractors are not being hit like the federal (civil service) employees. SES make much more than the “normal” civil service employee. Again, John Doe, SHAME ON YOU!

John Doe: It will NOT hurt the uniformed forces as many of the civilians stifle progression. Many Soldiers move earth by escavator; however, many civilians are destined to use the common table spoon to do the same because it’s job security in doing so. Why do we need civilians to process military orders, pay, and records, when we have Soldiers that are fully trained and capable of doing the same? Are you accustomed to going to the store and paying double for your goods and/or services? I’d say no. So, as an American taxpayer, why should I? Bottom line upfront, if there is a military occupational specialty that is in direct reflection of that of a DoD civilian, then that civilian position should be terminated.

Maybe so, but is was this president that did the bail-outs. It was this president who continues with the “war”, 6 years after he took office it is still going on and costing the government an ungodly amount of money. With all of the military men and women who were hurt, maimed and killed collecting money for the rest of their lives, as it shold be don’t get me wrong. The point I am trying to make is that the longer the war goes on the more military people who will get hurt and collect what is their due for being hurt. It is a big huge snowball, that will continue for many many years to come. It isn’t the civil service employees that have done any of this, yet we are paying the price. This president gave the okay the bail out civilian corporations. This presidents pushed the Affordable Health Care that , in part, took away MY health care (Tri-Care Prime). And yes, I am a military retiree who hasn’t seen a raise in COLA for a couple of years, with the exception of this year — that also was this president. So, please, blame it on who needs to be blamed — this president.

I totally agree as there are many retired senior military officials who are partnering with Northrup Grumman, Raytheon, and others who introduce products to the uniformed forces that are worthless. Claims to turn off-the shelf products into military grade, but after billions of dollars in studies, tests, and modifications end up costing more than if the DoD had designed and manufactured it itself. Take that stupid valcro uniform, the ACU, this was the worst decision ever imagineable. If the pattern was the issue, then why not change the pattern, but keep the old design? Also, there’s nothing wrong with long lasting BLACK leather boots while in garrison and preserve the desert boots for combat. Again — these are decisions made by civilians and shoved down the throats of Soldiers!

Brian: No one is buying that same ole cry… Cutting the civilian force WILL NOT take away from this nation’s military posture or readiness. You’ve had your decade of government welfare at the expense of the nation under the color of war, now go out and compete for a job like everyone else; to include returning Soldiers of the war. You are no exception! If you have a problem with my assessment, thank that lazy rascal sitting alongside you that does little for her/his pay outside of stealing oxygen and giving others a hard time…

GAKC: It would do little as Congress is paid mostly via Special Interest Groups! Stop the lobbiests and you’ll get the peoples representation back…

Diana: How many hours per week do you spend shamming on the clock; please be honest with yourself. You know — shopping for shoes, purses, jewelry, posting comments to sites like this, etc… If you were essential to your division, your boss will have the means of exempting you from these stiflings; however, if you’re what I described and are protected by virtue of time on the job and can’t be fired as easily, take this time off to reflect on how better to do your job and to support those you promised to support when first interviewing for the job. No cheese or crackers for that whine…

Hopeful…I find it difficult to believe that you are both a retiree and a DoD employee. Why? Your spelling/writing skills are awful! Can anyone take you seriously if you cannot even spell words correctly? Some advise for you, after you write something, read it over.

Other than that, I hope that it will not come to that either, for your sake and hundreds of others, including myself.

Why does the military need a civilian LPN when it has medics that are far better trained and can deploy at a moments notice and anywhere in the world?

Oh Dave, you misguided man. You need to get out more. The way of the world is not the Bible, it is people getting along with each other. Putting your head in the sand will not help matters.

The problem is that they are not going to cut the pet projects liek the F35 they are going to use people. The question is why are they announcing it now? Could it be so that they can beat up congress to force them to go along with what the President wants saying look at all the people that have served us through out the wars we will have to fire or lay off if you don’t agree to what the president wants now.

Maybe if you were one of the 800,000 civilians losing a day of pay a week (that is a 20% paycut for the mathematically challenged … like you!), then you might shut your stupid mouth!!!! I’m sick and tired hearing buttholes like you telling me I’m overpaid, when I get screwed every year with virtually no pay increase … not anywhere near even the cost of living increase!!!

We, government civilians, have sacrificed our annual pay increases for a few years now and now we again become the easiest target in DoD. I am an Army civilian. I work in, what is commonly referred to as, a green suiter organization. I have not been able to attend any professional development courses or conferences while I see “Green Suiters” leaders in my organization spending excessively in travels and logistics that are totally unnecessary. I’ve also seen an increase in the amount of contractor employees at least 5 times fold. We, government civilians, are everywhere soldiers are with the exception of the battlefield carrying assault weapons, but we are there. What they ought to be doing is doing a better job at oversight of spending and awarding lucrative contracts. I see how these contractors are making three figures and either not doing much or freeing a green suiter so he/she doesn’t have to do much. Enough with sacrificing the federal civilian workforce!

I agree. My husband is a traveling DoD civilian employee who works hand-in-hand with active duty military. His team is a very hard working group. They are cutting back in the wrong sector. My husband is getting it done for the DoD. Cutting time from the worker-bees schedule is stupid.

Sure, Tom, great plan. Working for a military agency, I’d love the DoD to try and cycle officers through my position every two to four years and actually see a quality product in the end. My position requires an incredible amount of training and real world experience before independent work is even realized. Trying to equate “minimum wager” positions with a lot of the civilian jobs in the DoD is thoughtless. Not happening in my lifetime…

“Defence” is the British spelling of the word.

Some ADVICE for you, after you write something, read it over.

Is it really necessary to tear someone else down for you to make your point? It doesn’t actually make you seem smarter or make your point more legitimate.

Great, a 20% cut in my pay. Now I’ll have to ditch female hookers and go for trannies instead.

–PCA Adams, Secret Service

Oh yes the government cuts would be great! Are you serious? We are talking about people lives here, with children, mortgages, bills etc. How does that help them? My son works for the DOD and has 2 children with another on the way. How about we stop helping the rest of the world and help our own!

What they need to do is stop buying new furniture every year and new computers. Then get reid of any one above the GS10 level or drastrictly reduce the number or 12 and 13 , get rid of half of congress and have of the senate. or lower their pay because they are not doing a very good job so I give them a 4 on their eval, maybe even a 5. check out what the Military is spending should be on stuff for troops overseas not here. As they are the ones fighting the War not the big wigs here. because I know at the end of the year or spend money or we won’t get next year. What a crock of bull. So they spend and they don’t need.

can a furlough create over time?

You have no idea what you are talking about. Who do you think pulls the orders for our military, set up all the procedures to get them from a to b. Making sure their pay is taken care of so that when they go off to war they know that their money will go to where it is suppose to. Make sure their families are taken care of? Who do you think orders all the needs and equipment for our troops. Your a jerk. I have been working for the DOD for 33 years and despite that some of the people believe we are useless, we work. Even out in the corporate world there is always going to be people that don’t give it all they have. I am so proud of the work that I have done and the troops that I have worked with and taken care of. And by the way yes we can get fired, I have seen it done. No we don’t have more rights then the military. When we get sick we have to use our leave. When the military get sick no matter for how long, they still get paid and never use their leave as it should be. They are at war and deserve this benifit you idiot. Before you start speaking your mind you better find out the real facts. Maybe you have this opinion because it’s one of your friends that is a civil service worker that brags he has the best job in the world because he does nothing. Well we do work hard and next time you see a soldier coming home to his or her family you can thank a civil service worker for getting them home.

Bullying is the use of force or coercion to abuse or intimidate others. Pres Obama has bullied Congress and they have called him on it. Sequestration will NOT SAVE money. Sequestration means less income for thousands of American’s in the Gov’t, and the trickle down effect will cause other jobs to disappear; i.e., in grocery stores, in gasoline stations, in child care centers, the household cleaning services, department stores and the list continues. Sequestration will also lower the amount of taxes generated for the Gov’t. Obama’s actions points to making us a socialist country. His actions also make me wonder where his loyalties are–the USA or…? We don’t have true unbiased journalism; we don’t have a President who cares and we have a Congress that only cares for their re-election. What can we do? Create and sign petitions for our President and our Congress to do their jobs. You and I both know what if we were in charge of a company and never, in four years, made a budget, we would be fired. Never would we be able to continue giving ourselves raises while continually not doing our jobs…we would be fired after one year. I could give you many examples of our ineffective government — but, we, as American citizens are just as bad. Why? Because we permit our Gov’t to be ineffective. What are you going to do about it–just complain and no action? Me, too. My excuse–I don’t have one.

Talk to your Congressman about why Contractor’s are hired. It will be interesting to see if they will tell you the truth.I don’t understand why you are getting the pay of a GS-08 if you have the training and experience of a GS-12. Why not go work for private companies where your experience will be better appreciated. Get away from the government. My brother-in-law retired from the Army 3rd Armored Division and took a civilian job as a semi-tractor truck mechanic and made great money with good benefits. Don’t EVER depend on the government for anything and you’ll be happier…and wealthier.

Military service is voluntary, not mandatory.

What I find amazing is that people in this country continue to re-elect the same officials who are responsible for the spending and increasing government control over all of us. That not what the purpose of government is at all. The senate majority leader is senile and one of the greatest barriers to progress and the house minority leader made one of the worst blunders in history by lying her way through to pass the single greatest bomb to our economy in history. Yes, we are all paying for it! Until these same people wake up and look at what they are doing, there will never be any hope for our country to recover.

You don’t realize that federal payroll (including benefits) is 0.5 percent (not 5 percent but POINT FIVE percent) of the entire budget. You could lay them all off 100% full time and you’d still have 99.5% of the budget to content with. The problem is with the slackers such as yourself who don’t work for a living eating up all the entitlements. Quit attacking those who work, and ask those who don’t to step up to the plate instead or in “addition to”

heck with u blackowl, my wife and i are very hard working individuals and will loose 1,200 a month together and are still helping our kids and others in these trying times, we are included in these “cuts”. 20 years in the navy and 18 as a gov employee, we truly “serve our country” we are medical have to seen the damage these wars have done to our young people.…they will be loosers also with these cuts as well as disabled children.

I say if you have bills you can’t pay, send them to Congress.

I agree with you on the end of year spending to prevent from receiving less the next year; however, most sections do not get their budget until 9 months in the fiscal year and are told to make your purchases in a month or less. So, your office spends what isn’t needed? As for my office, we have to scrounge or make it work until we get our funds–so spending in a month is necessary. As far as your asinine comment about getting rid of GS levels above GS-10 really doesn’t make sense, and if you are a GS employee then you are shooting yourself in the foot. Who wants to forever stay a GS-10? GS-11 and higher should be a goal set for everyone, well at least those who are ambitious and hard working. NO SENSE, NO SENSE AT ALL!!

TCC,
What a horrible, horrible person you are! To stereotype every federal employee as if they were worthless reflects the type of person you are. Cutting the civilian force WILL affect the military’s posture and readiness to some degree. If my job does not get done, then it greatly affects the military and national security. The military positions were converted to civilian positions because there is a dying need for continuity. The military work force is stretched very thin due to deployment requirements that leave many duties unattended. It is the civilian force that maintain the “other” less popular duties. And for your information, there are very many civilian positions that are occupied by retired veterans–myself, who has proudly served 20 yrs and deployed twice, but spent because of the high ops temp and constant separation from my husband and young kids. Yes, I have witness some civilians who has taken advantage of the system, but were duly corrected and back on the right path in my office…but that is in any profession–fed civ, military, and civilian community. So, you see, I absolutely disagree with you assessment, and have concluded it is a very UNEDUCATED assessment because I am a “Soldier of War” and a “federal civilian!”

Well said!

We forgot that Congress increased the new FERS employees retirement contribution to something like 4.6% compared to present employees rate of .08%. It didn’t take long for them to agree that it was only fair to increase ours this year too. I heard April our rate go to 1.8% and that is not towards thrift savings either. This was the big push to give us the 1% pay increase, to offset the additional burden of previous pay freeze and cola. Somebody out there on a blog asked if this would qualify us to wear the “1%er” patch now… why not it seems were running with the same type crowd:)

Looks like it is time to kick DOD to the side and work for an organization that actually cares for its employees by cutting wasts before employees. DOD knew about this possiblility in 2011. Now it is here and this is the best solution.…LAME.

Maybe we can make cuts and still protect this country from terrorism, people like yourself need to focus on the next 8 years and not the previous 8 years

ding ding ding.…..

Same here @ DLA, though I’m luckier than many of my other co-workers. the 20% reduction will bury a large majority. Nevermind the flood of people that will look for part-time work, the loss of tax revenue BECAUSE of this insanity… all to save “$5Billion”? Congress has slit all of our throats and they can’t be bothered with reducing their own salaries because ‘it’s beneath their dignity” says Ms. Pelosi.

“Pentagon officials said they don’t plan to lay off these positions. However, the Defense Department will eliminate the 46,000 temporary civilian positions.” That is a flat out lie. Temporary, permanent AND contractors are all affected.

I think theirs a law that was passed ‚that they could not furlough veteran’s or disabled veterans if it was less then 31 days

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