Hagel signals big military changes in store

Hagel signals big military changes in store

Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel said “fundamental change” is needed to reorganize and better prepare the U.S. military for an era of shrinking federal budgets and evolving global threats.

In his first major policy speech, delivered at Fort McNair in Washington a week before the release of the White House’s fiscal 2014 budget request, Hagel said a strategic review of the force will scrutinize key areas of defense spending, including weapon acquisitions, personnel and overhead.

“This effort will by necessity consider big choices that could lead to fundamental change and a further prioritization of the use of our resources,” he said in prepared remarks. “Change that involves not just tweaking or chipping away at existing structures and practices but where necessary fashioning entirely new ones that are better suited to 21st century realities and challenges.”

Hagel didn’t specify what areas of the budget will be most affected, though he said the review will seek to answer “tough questions,” such as the proper mix of civilian and military personnel; the right breakdown of officers and enlisted members; and the appropriate distribution of troops in combat, support and administrative duties.

The Defense Department’s budget will shrink by almost $500 billion over the next decade under deficit-reduction legislation passed in 2011. It faces another $500 billion in automatic reductions, unless Congress and the White House agree on an alternate spending measure. The first installment of automatic cuts, which began March 1, will slice the defense budget by as much as $41 billion in the remaining half of fiscal 2013, which began Oct. 1.

“Left unchecked, spiraling costs to sustain existing structures and institutions, provide benefits to personnel, and develop replacements for aging weapons platforms will eventually crowd out spending on procurement, operations and readiness – the budget categories that enable the military to be and stay prepared,” Hagel said.

The Pentagon, under then-Defense Secretaries Robert Gates and Leon Panetta, has already taken steps to reduce spending while investing in such critical areas as drones, cybersecurity and special forces, Hagel said. A strategic review last year called for shifting emphasis away from the ground wars of the past decade and toward the Asia-Pacific region.

“We will have to do more,” he said. “We cannot simply wish or hope our way to carrying out a responsible national security strategy and its implementation.”

The Defense Department this year plans to force more than 700,000 civilian personnel to take unpaid leaves of absence, or furloughs, for 14 days this year, down from 22 days previously, in part to shore up money for high-priority accounts such as operations and maintenance.

Hagel, who pledged to dock his own pay by an equal amount, said the action was necessary after lawmakers allowed the automatic cuts to take effect. “I wish we had other options,” he said after his speech in a response to a question from an audience member. “We are dealing with a $41 billion shortfall that was not planned for.”

In his remarks, Hagel said most security challenges today won’t necessarily be solved with conventional military power. Violent extremism continues to rise from weak states and ungoverned areas in the Middle East and North Africa, he said. The military must adapt to stay “relevant” amid threats that are entirely different than those from the Cold War, he said.

“Indeed, the most destructive and horrific attack ever on the United States came not from fleets of ships, bombers, and armored divisions, but from 19 fanatical men wielding box cutters and one-way plane tickets,” he said, referring to the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.


Join the Conversation

…so far so good, Sec. Hagel…you talk the talk, now run to catch we who are already walking that walk…
…all the Defense Contractors’ CEO’s sky-high salaries in the World won’t stop cyber-war 2020…
…or U.S.A. losing the next non-State, asymetric battle…
…the F-35 will make good gate guards…and the GCV will make good playground equipment…
…remember “the Horror” upriver…time for Mil-dom-Civ…not Civ-damn-Mil…
…the imminent Military Coup — a flood of Mr. Clean…stand down the “MIC”, Globally…
…stand UP the people, who will lead U.S. All…to victory…

The Defense Secretary cited the period between WWI and WWII as a prime example of doing more with less. Anyone with a historical knowledge have anything to add?

The really big money in the DOD budget is personnel. Pay & benefits for active duty personnel have skyrocketed. It comes down to rolling back pay & benefits or rolling back numbers of active duty people. One can talk all day long about cost escalation in weapons systems, O&M, etc., etc., etc. If they are going to get this monster under control, they have to tackle the people costs.

Well the War Department acted smashingly when WW1 veterans demonstrated for their bonus. They Washington Naval Treaty relieved the Navy of having to maintain expensive BBs and CCs. Of course, many of those that remained had maintenance issues due to budgetary shortfalls. The Army Air Force and Marine Corps went into WW2 with state of the art P-39s and Brewster Buffaloes.

Perhaps, this wasn’t what Secretary Hagel was referring to? Never mind.

Um … Pearl Harbor comes to mind.

The main thing these sorts of discussions around reform leave out is that the Pentagon ultimately doesn’t control it’s funding and therefore doesn’t control it’s priorities to the degree that sweeping and timely reform is possible. The latest example is how Strykers are being shoved down the Army’s throat in spite of the insistence that there’s no requirement for them.

“Hagel signals big military changes in store”

For “big changes”, read “huge cuts”.

That’s what one Obama political operative openly admitted on national television. The Obama administration intends to make “huge cuts” to defense spending (in those exact words), and they thought the only way they could render that politically palatable was to reach across the aisle and nominate a Republican SECDEF to do the cutting.

It displays a frankly frightening level of historical ignorance for Hagel to talk about the interwar period from the end of WWI to the start of WWII as “adapting to new realities”. It was instead a period of ignoring reality. And as a result, the United States was grossly underequipped when war came. Old weapons and not enough of them. Many thousands of American servicemen paid with their lives for that lack of preparedness.

(A friend of my uncle recalled the prewar U.S. Navy of 1940. In his words, they had “nothing, just nothing”. As a newly minted ensign, he reported aboard a decrepit coastal steamer with no weapons on board, not even small arms. And was expected to take that unmaintained, barely seaworthy vessel out in the Atlantic to patrol for submarines, with zero training in shiphandling, much less ASW.)

The only way that the United States was able to overcome that deficit of preparedness was by a massive push to retool the civilian industrial base for war work. That was when America had a huge civilian industrial base with considerable spare capacity, a situation that no longer obtains. Such a retooling push would be totally implausible today.

No transcript, so I had to go to C-Span to write down exactly what he said, instead of what I thought I remembered.

“The US military has always proved capable of adapting to new realities, even when resources were relatively scarce. Consider the lean inter-war years between WWI and WWII during the Great Depression a group of farsighted officers with virtually no funding or prospect for promotion. You will remember in your history a long Gen, Eisenhower was a lieutenant colonel. A good example of what we are talking about. They conceived important new concepts for armored warfare, amphibious assault, aircraft carriers, submarines, and long range bombers all which proved decisive in the second world war.”

Correction:You will remember in your history how long Gen, Eisenhower was a lieutenant colonel.

The troops called the Sherman Tank the “Ronson” becuase it would light on fire every time it was hit. We had no tanks worth mentioning and had to go with the one we could mass produce. We had more tanks than the Germans but they had better tanks. The 75mm cannon on the Sherman could not penetrate the frontal armor of the Tiger Tank. The Sherman tankers had to mob the Germans so that someone could get a shot from the rear.

Prior to the war, soldiers trained with 2x4 marked “machine gun”. It was really effective.

LTC? He was a Major for over 16 years…

Excellent points but I think it was actually the Germans I think that called the Sherman a Ronson (a brand of lighter at the time)

Tough to get people to volunteer and serve during a time of war…

Excellent points.

Also at work is that many on the left and some libertarians believe cutting the capability of the military will make us less interventionist. They consistently fail to learn the lessons of WWII and are never held to account for their foolishness.

Here is a golden opportunity to reorganize the acquisition system by extirpating the current one (which garners the military and taxpayers the lousiest deal in the western world) and replacing it with one similar to that used by the British. They use a threat analysis board comprised of civilian and military experts that analyze threats, and determine the force structures and weapons required to defeat those threats.

This removes huge redundancies, prevents design changes from being made all the say through the construction phases, ensures continuity and compatibility between the service branches, and removes congress from everything except budgeting.

Hence — the military gets what they need at drastically reduced costs, while saving the taxpayers huge amounts of money.

Ugh, please don’t bring up the 19th century minded libertarian perspective.

He talks big talk. We’ll see what materializes.

Well, Mr. Hagel…there is ONE problem with your speech…its called politics. And to demonstrate why POLITICS play a HUGE part in disarming this country and lowering readiness can be found right inside of the pentagon its self. 700,00 civilians doing the jobe 700,000 military personel used to do…all with higher saleries, and huge benefits packages that rival those of Lock-Mart and Boeing. Cut the civilians and start making the military doits own work will save strength, add to readiness, and enabe a HUGE savings where its needed most.

Hagel thought process?:

“I think that this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody’s part.” (and) ” We’re just the guys to do it.”

Hasn’t been recently. The economy has been so bad young people are climbing over themselves to enlist anywhere, anyhow they could.

Sincere respect to Aurora for recalling the state of the art in 1941, but also I understand that the Americans were still operating Curtiss P-26’s in the Philippines. You can imagine the results when the Zeros came over the horizon.

Thanks, Chris, but I was being sarcastic in my reference. The Zeros murdered the Buffaloes at Midway. Hell, the P-39s did better, but we didn’t really have a superior fighter until the Hellcats and Mustangs arrived. The P-38 could out dive it, but couldn’t outmaneuver the Zero.

We in fact had heavy tanks, the M6 and M26 were under development. The strategic decision was made to ship over 2 Shermans instead of 1 heavy. The Sherman was also equipped with the high velocity 76mm, a very potent weapon with the right ammunition. The Sherman was superior to the German tanks in some important respects. They were faster, more reliable, more economical and easier to work on… By the time the M-26 arrived (an outstanding tank) the war was nearly over… won by Shermans despite their deficiencies.

The cost has gone down also. The overwhelming majority of the bonuses are gone.


You can only do less with less. The mantra more with less is garbage.

The British System has not worked so well in many recent acquisitions including the “Bowman” Communiciations System, Astute Submarine and the NIMROD MRA4 patrol aircraft. All have run years and years with costs well above what anyone expected. Storm Shadow missile is extremely expensive and not more capable than weapons costing significantly less.

You mean the Same military who has the F-35B being designed and the vast majority of the R&D being payed for by the USA?

Or the Royal Navy which can’t even patrol its shores and launch a few missiles on a 3rd rate nation?

Or a Navy which had only a few Tomahawks to fire at the Libyans?

Yes contrary to most of the Bullshit you hear on the TV the US (Once again) Did almost everything in Libya-a war we had no fight in simply because the Europeans didn’t have the will or power to do it themselves.

They can have their massive Welfare states because the US takes care of them militarily. Didn’t even have enough bombs to finish the war. So we gave them some of ours.

You mean that military? I can go on and on. That Board of “Experts” has killed countless Brave soldiers of Britain with expectations of their “Next” war.

It is the truth we need to rid civilians of jobs that can will be handle by our own military. The way it use to be. We made our own police calls , handle duties and details on our post and everything went okay. The first sgt handle all the paper work and designated nco’s to handle the tasks in hand. And it would last for one week. And then alternated to another company and so on. That’s being in control and great leadership.

“Defense Secretary Hagel said “fundamental change” is needed to prepare the military for an era of shrinking budgets.“
Thumbs up ^…

We have a much more “joint” DoD than we have ever had. everybody uses a HMMWV. Start trimming excess personnel in the Material Commands. AMC (A Million Civilians) serves no purpose. Put CECOM, TACOM, AMCOM… under DLA, and completely eliminate AMC HQ slots. Do something similar with all of the services, and you probably get rid of 100,000 high paid civilians.

And the long knives come out — time for the Army to stab the USMC in the back and vice-a-versa. Same with the Air Force and Navy. It’s going to be funny (or sad) to watch, but this is “no way to run a railroad”.

… could be achieved by cutting the GS’s number and life long high salaries/retirements. Keep the military intact and let them do the civilian job.

Thats not true.…I’m in that foxhole

We get what we VOTE for!!!

Overall, I hope the plan includes a new commander-in-chief. Someone preferably having US interest, preemptive negotiation skills, and fiscal management skills to get us through any crisis.

In civilians, I hope you are refering to contractors? I am a Title 32 Dual Status Technician, (Air National Guard) which means mon-fri I wear ABU’s but am a GS-11, on Drill weekends I am a MSgt. I am currently facing a 14 day furlough. I pay for my own health/dental (with the gov offsetting some), I pay for my own housing & ALL OTHER BENIFITS that active duty have paid for them. I have been in for 28.5 years, but unlike active duty, if I retired yesterday I would not receive one cent in retirement until I am 60+ (active duty collects first payday after 20).. The Guards mantra since I have been in is “do more with less” which we always do. So before you tell me what a millionare I am, consider the fact I havent received COLA for 2 years & congress just added year 3!! Title 32s are cheaper & more experienced than any active duty unit, we never PCS (more $$ saved) & usually stay in Guard our whole careers. So when you say civilians, do your homework, contracors cost is staggering & they are not even being touched/talked about during this budget fiasco.…

There are probably many civil servants that could be replaced by military, but you can’t keep expertise in highly technical fields in uniform, so the number of contractors has to increase. That costs even more (we just spent 5 years cutting as many contractors as possible).

I am a Title 32 Dual Status Technician, (Air National Guard) which means mon-fri I wear ABU’s but am a GS-11, on Drill weekends I am a MSgt. I am currently facing a 14 day furlough. I pay for my own health/dental (with the gov offsetting some), I pay for my own housing & ALL OTHER BENIFITS that active duty have paid for them. I have been in for 28.5 years, but unlike active duty, if I retired yesterday I would not receive one cent in retirement until I am 60+ (active duty collects first payday after 20).. The Guards mantra since I have been in is “do more with less” which we always do. So before you tell me what a millionare I am, consider the fact I havent received COLA for 2 years & congress just added year 3!! Title 32s are cheaper & more experienced than any active duty unit, we never PCS (more $$ saved) & usually stay in Guard our whole careers. So when you say civilians, do your homework, contracors cost is staggering & they are not even being touched/talked about during this budget fiasco.…

I like what I see and I think it’s about time the position, Chairman of the Joint Chief of Staff to be given a (5) star. The one in charge!

” Left unchecked, spiraling costs to sustain existing structures and institutions, provide benefits to personnel, and develop replacements for aging weapons platforms will eventually crowd out spending on procurement, operations and readiness – ” Excuse me but isn’t replacing “aging weapons systems” critical to “readiness”?

Shall we throw rocks at the North Koreans and the Chinese that are sure to follow?

As a Vietnam vet I remember a scheme by then Scty of Defense McNamara to eliminate the individual services and combine all the services together. Thought it was crazy but if you think about it , the savings would be significant. Why not combine the Marines and Army. They are both ground forces. The Air force in WWII was the Army Air Force and the Navy combined with the other services could share pilots, mechanics, and aircraft. Won’t be easy but maybe we need to do this to survive.

The Sherman was in fact faster than the Tiger, more maneuverable than the Tiger, generally more reliable and economical than the Tiger, and the LONG 76mm that came with the later model Sherman’s was a credible tank gun for the period, just not in the same league as the Tiger’s 88mm. But if you want to get right down to it, there were roughly 50 eastbound Sherman’s for every Tiger (and that does not even count the thundering hordes of westbound T-34s!).

Let’s be real, the 50:1 ratio had just a tiny little bit to do with the final outcome.

Absolutely, I couldn’t agree more with your view on the civil service bloated budget. I once upon a time got to work first hand with the rediculous waste of perfectly good resources.

If we perfect electronic weapons, lasers and particle beam weapons, we can trim the DoD budget by 65%.

Really? Are you sure? What about the total monetary outlay of the N. Vietnamese over the duration of the SEA conflict, or the cost of sustaining the Iraqi “insurgents” over the last 10 years? Consider the total “bang for the bucks” and they did pretty good against our barrage of dollars (high tech material and young Americans!)! You can’t do more with less unless you change the way you do what you do!

Perhaps it is just time to consider other ways! If it costs more to send a Predator to do a C-12 mission, perhaps we need to send the C-12, even if a twin engine, manned aircraft is NOT as sexy on the evening news. Spend every dollar necessary to adequately defend the US and our interests against any credible threat, just not a single cent for “looks”! Radical concept, but… might as well just toss it out as a possibility.

The USN came to your logical conclusion a while back. They tried to spend lots of money to eliminate crewmen on their new ships. They ended up with the Zumwalt class and the LCS’s. THEN they found out that no software module could substitute for warm bodies with mattresses and railroad ties on a damage control party! In the Army, it was trying to replace “boots on the ground” until they found out that precision guided artillery shells and Hellfire’s could not replace a boot against a door in urban warfare, particularly if you wanted to restrict collateral damage or were not really sure which door needed kicking. War is conducted by warriors, not machines. Forget that and you can spend some money in the near term in hopes of future returns, sound smart in budget hearings as you cite those “birds in the bushes”, and even play good partisan politics inside of the beltway. Then we get to relearn some very expensive lessons, when the bill is NOT enumerated in just an abstract dollar value or political prestige, but in lives, in the next war.

Please, don’t confuse the Wonk with facts, he is on a roll! Of course that was the line used on Belushi in Animal House as well! LOL!

For the DoD, it was $153 billion just on base pay, housing, subsistence, special pays, and PCS costs this year.

The P-38 was more than adequate against the Zero, unless the Lightning pilot tried to imagine that he could turn with the smaller, lighter, but unarmored Japanese fighter. Any other mode of flight, i.e. climb, dive, or simply a just flat-out full throttle run, and the Zero was left as a receding dot in the rear view mirror. JUST DONT TRY TO TURN WITH THE ZERO! And a very few fractions of a second flying through the cloud of projectiles that spewed from a P-38 could shred the Zero and incinerate the fragments. :-)

No. They are right. Ronsons were American-made lighters. Their sales slogan was, “Lights up first time, every time.” The term was first applied to the M3/4 Stuart tanks by British and Canadian troops.

Canada has combined all the forces years ago. It has saved the Canadian government a lot of money over the years.

I don’t know anything, but even I know your plan’s not gonna work.

For a realistic feeling of what took place back between those wars you can assess the various “treaties” such as the London agreement. But a vivid picture comes from browsing sites like Pigboats​.com which details just how much slashing of submarines and naval personnel went on, all to meet “International” agreements. Think of who was President and what were the national defense attitudes back then.

For a realistic feeling of what took place back between those wars you can assess the various “treaties” such as the London agreement. But a vivid picture comes from browsing sites like Pigboats​.com which details just how much slashing of submarines and naval personnel went on. Plus if you assess today’s personnel needs remember that our armed forces now are all volunteers and represent less than 1% of the population. So you are correct in assessing the costs but be aware they apply to smaller numbers of people.

Wow! Have you followed the British attempts to stay current in the nuclear deterrent and submarine world lately? They are making huge mistakes as their hardware (read submarines) is coming out of their yards with major deadly flaws. Also, their Threat Board approach seems always to lag our assessments. See for instance our use of Active Shark, a system utilizing real-time info systems to target and attack threats as they are EVOLVING!.

Canada uncombined their forces some years ago after finding that combining them just did not work. There is a continuing reason why navies and armies need to be separate, and that quite simply is the environment in which each operates, water versus land.

Say hello to “Hagel the Hatchet”.….. Clean out AMC, DLA and the rest of the bloated stateside agencies and commands. That of course, includes the puzzle palace itself, the Pentagon.…

Eliminate acronyms and then you can actually communicate with those damn civilians who have been out of the service since the ’60’s. Like me.

Well spoken facts! Case in point, when I was deployed to the balkans (prior to 9/11) I worked some dope deals with Brown and Loot to raise the standard of living at our camp (we weren’t task force, so no contingency bucks), and over the course of a few months built a raport with them. Towards the end of my deployment I was unofficially offered a position if I agreed to ETS (my enlistment was up in a few months) and apply for a position right there in Kosovo. The position involved driving a van, whether there were passengers or not, 45 kilometers back and forth three days a week for $80k a year. Nothing more. And it was tax free, no less. I opted to reenlist.

Moral of the story, contractors are overpaid in many cases and a thorough review of mission requirements and logistics should be completed OUTSIDE of a lobbyist provided steak dinner setting with dumb congressional pukes who are in it for themselves

With all the talk about Defense cuts, there should also be talk about cuts in commitments, commensurate with the cuts elsewhere. We are in a situation we have never been in before, namely, the huge debt that hangs over head . In previous crises we had fiscal flexibility that we no longer enjoy. A country’s armed forces can only be a strong as the economy will permit.

Dear Commentator. Sorry about that.

What high paid Government civilians are you referring to? Government employees haven’t received a pay increase in over three years and counting and now there being asked to give 20% of their salaries by being furloughed. Any intelligent person with half a brain cell knows you’ll never get rich as a government employee they do it because it’s a job and they enjoying serving their country. I find it odd when the economy is doing well and people are earning great salaries they belittle the federal employee for the meager pay they earn in comparison to private sector jobs but as soon as the economy dips then the whining starts about how federal employees make so much money and benefits. federal salaries are public knowledge look at the pay chart compared to private sector jobs. As for the comment of the service member doing the job well they could and they do but however then the argument would be the military is too big and they’re costing too much to have all these active duty personnel. You need and will always have military, contracted support and federal employes the goal should be to have a healthy complement of what’s necessary to accomplish the strategic and operational goals of our elected officials. The biggest travesty is that our elected officials are federal employees as well but they aren’t subjected to the same pay cuts and loss of benefits as the average federal employee that never take cuts have better health benefits and tell us to do more with less apologies for the emotional outburst it’s just frustrating when people comment about things they have no full knowledge of.

Slash Personal Services Contracts. HSSI Inc is at MCAS Yuma Arizona filling made up “assistant” positions and making up positions with work that is normally done by one GS employee. This company is completely out of control in Yuma. HAGEL…DO SOMETHING ABOUT THESE OUT OF CONTROL CONTRACTORS!

lets not forget that we use some of those venders in Europe also that blow up the prices of our military equipment. everything from radios to engines are made produced and then fixed in Europe its shocking.….….….….….……

I think both Government personnel and contractors all have to take a cut. In the DoD organization I work in, we have GS 14s and 15s doing jobs that MSgts were doing when I was active duty AF. Some DoD agencies are way too top heavy and where I work, the contractors are the ones doing the work and then there are 10 Government civiolians supervising. If our contractors left, the GS personnel wouldn’t be able to d the contractor’s jobs.

Canada has the luxury of having the US military on the same continent! Who will we look to when the SHTF?

Lots of fat to trim in all Government agencies…

Of course. I specifically stated that the main reason we went with Shermans was that numerical superiority was deemed to be better than individual superiority. I do question your 50:1 ratio… Let’s be real. We won the war for multiple, convergent reasons. Not any one factor…

Can we cut the number of admirals below the number of combat ships we have? Prefferably just 20 or so.

“God and the soldier
We adore
In times of danger
Not Before.
The danger past
And all things righted
God is forgotten and the soldier slighted!“
NEVER has this unfortunately true little verse been more accurate!
Hagel is simply another minion of the REAL culprit.… “BS” OBAMA!!!!

Here another Rush Limbaugh follower blaming President Obama for everything. This is a systemic problem created long before President Obama took office this is a result of decades of political policies created from both sides of the aisle

Well, if we make a gender neutral force we can certainly save on logistical concerns. For example, if we stopped segregating the barracks, we could save millions.

BS!! Congress received $1,900,00 COLA increase for 2013!

Good point Gay US Marine! They are already saying I can be in the infantry, why do they still have seperate barracks or berthing areas, I’ll never know?

We don’t need civilian contractors to earn the “big bucks” in any war zone. The various branches of the military can do the work required at lower pay and they are prepared for the hazards. When we go into war commence with a draft; if a war isn’t bad enough for everyone to fight then it isn’t bad enough for anyone to fight. Fight for the duration, don’t drag the wars out to enhance the bottom line of Fortune 500 companies. Get a POTUS that loves America and understands military procedure. Chuck, thanks for you and your brother’s Vietnam service I hope that by being one of the used you will not allow detrimental mistakes to our nation based on the desire for “stuff.”

USS Houston dying with the Aussie cruiser Perth under massive odds. The 4th marines going into captivity. P-40s and p-39s, and Brewster Buffaloes going down like flys with the pilots inside. Yep they coped and they died in massive numbers to take care of another civilian based screw up from 1916 to 1941.

Because no one is addressing the sexual assaults that are taking place regularly. Their trying to get there arms around the problem but it’s serious. Not to mention it’s going to take awhile to change attitude that are decades old and steeped in old ways of thinking just because yours something into law doesn’t mean attitudes change overnight

So the plan is to change our military based on one major suicide attack by terrorist on our country, and not against highly probable governments that have attacked us during bad global economic, cultural, and religious differences as in past history. We will become known as the sleeping giant once more.

Canada is NOT A WORLD SUPERPOWER LIKE the USA! Pre-WWII, our military was decimated by a lack of funding and especially…A lack of Leadership by FDR…The New Deal was a Disaster, further verified by FDR’s own Treasurer years later! When we were attacked by Japan, our country had to go into overdrive to begin to catch up with what we should have had all along in Military might and readiness.
It was WWII that saved America from its Depression!
Why is it that every time Dem’s cut the budget, they hit the Military? All while China, Russia, N.Korea all increase their budgets by the Hundreds of Billions? Oh I forget, They promise to be nice? But they finds Millions and Millions more to study why lesbians gain weight, while queer’s don’t?
I left my unit in ’96 after the reckless cuts by golden boy Bill…

Lord Help Us Now… As N. Korea’s wack-job President ?Authorizes? The use of Nuclear weapons against the USA… and Mr Obama refuses to leave San Francisco as he continues fund raising for the Dem. Party.
The very same Obama, on whom our Nation spent over $1,000,000,000.00 last year protecting, traveling, extravagant vacation’s… again and again, countless golf games, One Billion Dollars… And this man has the Gull to tell Americans to wear a leaner belt? While he lives like KING OBAMA.
Today, a Veteran neighbor’s wife, was turned away from a health care clinic, where she for the last 6 years has received her Chemo Drug Treatments…Because, Medi-Care has gutted the reimbursement rates so badly, they e money by attending to any Medicare Patient. ex. Doctor spends 45minutes performing a detailed exam…HIS Reward…$18.00 (Eighteen dollars). OBAMA CARE Preview. Rationed health care,
why else do Canadians cross the border for mediocre Hernia surgery? Oh yeah, the 3 year WAIT!!!!!

The period between the wars was noted mostly by isolationism and non preparedness. Only after Pearl Harbor did we really take our position in the world seriously. I’m 75 years old and I remember Pearl Harbor, as a young boy. Korea caught us with our pants down again. Every time we get through a war, the Pols cut the military to the bone. Thank God for Patriots who answer the call. Chief Boring, USN Ret.

Federal employees, since they became unionized, enjoy pay and benefits well above the civilian worker, and state employees. As a state employee who dealt with federal agencies, I can tell you they are bloated with personnel and are grossly overpaid for what we get out of them. look it up, then comment.

Exempted from cuts under sequestration: Active duty, appointed and elected federal employees. I believe that Jack Williams was referring to government civilians that are employed under DoD, not elected or appointed government civilians. FYI: DoD civilians above the GS/GG pay grade (i.e. the SES (Senior Executive Service) grades are appointed, but paid through congressional budget. Another fact: The SES pay (up until March 27, 2013) had been frozen since 2010. As of March 27, 2013, government civilians (GS and SES pay grades) were allowed a 0.5 percent increase! That’s right a 0.5 percent increase after a pay freeze that had been effect since 2010 levels. Keeping up with how much our pay (federal employee/government civilian pay) has been cut, frozen, and jacked up is a difficult chore. You can read all about government civilian pay by visiting the OPM​.gov website. You’re right about Congress receiving a COLA increase, but then again; they’re the ones who set the rules, and those rules typically favor themselves, while restricting or freezing pay for other government civilians. Another interesting tidbit. Just this week, I heard a Defense Contractor negotiating possible salary with a prospective employer (overheard part of his phone conversation). He indicated that his salary, without benefits, was currently $130,000.00 — This person was a mid-level technician. Not a high level supervisor or management. The highest pay rate on the GS (non-executive level) pay scale is GS-15/Step-10 — They make a salary of $129,517 annually.

I work in the defense civilian workforce, was previous active duty and now work closely with active duty. It is apparent you haven’t a clue what you are talking about when it comes to pay and who is cheaper to employ. It is significantly more expensive to replace civilians/contractors with active duty. An E-5 in the Navy right now takes home more money than contractors and GS employees, this is a statement of fact, not an opinion. Our office is 25 civilian and 20 active duty, as a reference. We actually did the unthinkable and compared paychecks and the active duty military sailors got a huge wake-up call as to just how much they actually make, compared to the civilian workforce.
So, before you make bogus and false claims, you should do your homework. I have.

Didn’t you ever see the movies of our modern Army making war on a tank? The tank was played by a truck, with a sign on the side that said “tank”. They shot flour at it. This was to represent actual warfare.

See my reply above for information regarding pay of government civilians. While you are assuming that ‘all’ government civilians are union employees, you are wrong. Most are not. Many postal employees are union members, and there are others, but employees in most of the intelligence agencies (DoD employees) are not. Regarding the pay equivalencies — You can look up federal government pay on the OPM website: http://​www​.opm​.gov. For comparisons with non-federal employees, you can find websites that show pay comparisons. Also refer to my reply above. (After 20 years as enlisted military, 6 years as defense contractor and 2 years as a gov’t civilian) It has been my experience that most federal government civilians (in the DoD) are paid less than their non-federal contractor equivalents. Federal civilian employees (in the DoD) have more responsibilities and less pay. I’m sure it’s not the same across all segments of federal service, but the DoD has a highly skilled, highly educated work force, and I haven’t met many (there’s always some) employees who didn’t deserve the money they’re paid.

I am glad I am retired from civil service. I was in accounting for the USAF for 25 years. both as military and civilian. Never saw a budget that didn’t get signed by 01/01 in that ffiscal year and that was rare and under this presidency this is the worst I have ever seen it. The Air Force and other branches of service who defend this country have sqeezed has much out of a penny as they possibly could. The civilian work force have many talented employees whom could be making a lot more money outside of the government. I can’t understand how anyone could vote for a president with no military experience, goes to a church that hates white people, never showed up as a senator to sponsor a bill, and never gives time off to his secret service personne at XMAS because he has to go to Hawaii every year.

What Hagel is saying is that basically we won’t have much of a Defense Dept when he’s through with it. Yes shrinking Defense budgets because of increased nanny state budgets.

And Infantry Branch told him to “Got Out” because he did not deploy to Europe for WW1 so would never amout to much.

Exactly!!!! Plus they also get increases in their pay when the military get their measly pay raisess!!

They would rather spend the money political correct projects!! Not the lowly military as seen in their eyes!

Hello 1974 all over again. The hollow military is coming due to budget cuts. The first to go is training and then R&D. Followed by reductions in force and the ensuing largesse in getting combat ready systems. Then there is the possibility of non-deployable assets during a time of crisis. Morale will plummet and there you have a new round of finger pointing. This time the Soviet Union isn’t the menace, but there are other bad actors with advanced capabilities out there to be deterred. What comes around, goes around.

If you’re going to cut the pay and benefits of those people who will put their lives at risk so you can sit back safe and sound and complain about everything, before you cut their pay and benefits you cut the Presidents and Congress pay and bennies as they are the reason why we are in this Mess.

Remember they spend more money on Welfare, Food Stamps, Section 8 Housing, Medicare Disability which is the new form of Unemployment compensation when your 99 weeks have run out, Unemployment pay and all the loans to those “green Energy” companies that keep going belly up

Always pick on the Military but never the people that really caused the problem

USMC evolves Fleet Marine Force structure, doctrine and equipment in prep for Pacific campaigns in this period.

Germany evolves dismounted stormtroop tactics, a successful technique in trench warfare into blitzkrieg with mounted forces to surprise Europe.

Both with very limited $$

Remember Task Force Smith in Korea, June 1950! http://​www​.historycentral​.com/​k​o​r​e​a​/​t​a​s​k​_​f​o​r​c​e​_sm… __

Once again, instead of cutting wasteful spending and unnecessary programs, another Democrat /politician jumps on the bandwagon to cut military benefits for our warriors. Military personnel are just another “middle class” that our government is going to suck the life from. When are Americans going to wake up? Look at the salaries our government officials have for doing nothing but smirking about in Washington, DC. It’s so corrupt. Meanwhile, some young man or young woman, making a whopping 40,000.00 a year or less, is shipped to a warzone, leaving the safety of their country and their families behind. If they get wounded, they come back to less than adequate health care — believe me — it might be inexpensive compared to some, but IT IS NOT THE HIGHEST QUALITY MEDICAL CARE!!!!! I know. I am a Marine Corps veteran. I had the worse possible care at the Hampton, Virginia Veterans Hospital. But still, politicians will cut us to the quick. WAKE UP AMERICA! We are barely able to keep our heads above water and they keep on taking what little money we can make!

Oboma stating he will cut his pay 5%+20K. what about a 20% like the rest of the prople. The 5% he is taking is close to the pay of otheres that are taking a 20% cut.

No, we don’t. I don’t think anybody voted for a house of reps that refuse to do it’s job. The SECDEF, whichever party he happens to be apart of, will make the adjustment to the money given, some are good at it, and some are not.…In any event, you can’t do more with less, anybody that say you can is either an idiot, running for office, or lieing.….I prefer the latter. The most important thing is to take the money you are given and purchase the things you need, as oppose to the things you want, Militarily.

Janet Napolitano has the solution. Start a second army (like a certain German had). There has to be a reason she is buying thousands of weapons, millions of rounds of ammo, and armored vehicles. There has to be an answer. Could there be a method to weakening the military?

“Hagel signals big military changes in store“
I have observed that when a political type says he will do one thing, he may actually be doing another.

For “big changes”, read “huge cuts”.
There will be no cuts, only talk about cuts, and endless debate on what not to cut.

Tricare for active only and a chained cola is coming.

There’s way too much waste in all Federal agencies — DoD is one of the worst. There are (literally) hundreds of ways to save Billions $. It’s a matter of changing the mindset of the bureaucrats. 1.) Allow managers to remove non-performers (right now it’s practically impossible). 2.) Fix the procurment system (it’s way too difficult to buy things in the government). 3.) Eliminate HR Regional Centers (They are just another unnecessary layer of processors in the hiring process). 4.) Eliminate/Simplify pay-for-performance (in theory its great but way too many approval chains just give a hard worker a $500 bonus). 5.) Eliminate or drastically cut back on the Navy Marine Corp Intranet (NMCI) roles and responsibilities. These are just 5 of the lowest hanging fruit. There’s hundreds more.

We can’t afford all these nice-to-haves anymore. Empower people to do their jobs and make them accountable when they dont. — just like in industry — and we can eliminate huge amounts of waste. If changes like this can’t be made because we’re too engrained in our current policies, then we get what we deserve.

Wait a minute now. Just last week half of you guys was whinning about the SECDEF NOT doing his job, now he IS doing his job, you still whine. You Whine because he is not doing the things some of YOU like. Well.…heres a news flash for ya, It’s-not-about-you!, it’s about the Country. If some of you really want to help, stop putting people in Congress that couldn’t manage a outhouse, let alone a Political House. Because this is about more than just their districts, if that were not the case.…then they can stay in their districts and do nothing.

I’m glad somebody tells the truth. On average, fed employees receive 26% less than private sector counterparts performing similar tasks.

Look I spent 24 years on active duty to this country. I retired as a 1SG from NORAD/ NORTHCOM I was a Nuclear, Biological, and Chemical specialist. I wrote the training drills for all of North America. When 911 happened I set up with my team the warning and defense for 56 UN in Nov 7–17 2011. After the Wheels up of the President I set down with the State Department and the FBI and worked out the defense of the Atlanta Olympics. FBI offered me a job for double what I was making as an E-8. Upon my Retirement I turned down a GS-13 job making 60,000 a year more. I point I’m making is as NCO in the Army I made way less than the Civilians around me and who worked for me. Civilians get paid over time a soldier all was works overtime. Now for my high retirement pay I get $2,600 a month for my 24 year my knees are shot my back and hip are gone all so when you wake up in the morning you can say I made too much. I have to pay out of my retirement for my wife to get money if die and for Tricare dental as well wish leave me with $1800 dollars. People how much do the leaders of our country make check that out in retirement? What about a people that play games like Basketball, Football and Baseball just to name a few? How did the make your life safer? Think about it. We are the best Army in the world by far but we are 8th on the pay scale Holland pays its soldiers more. Now when you awoke this morning what was the first thing you thought about if it wasn’t I hope I can make it with being shoot today think a soldier.

Because we defend Canadian and their coastal area so they don’t need a large Army. We have systems set up and NORAD is a big part of the defenses.

when you furlough the civil servants for the 14 days as scheduled, you could save roughly 6.4 Billion dollars in the final months of FY13. Including the President, if all of the members of Congress, the Senate, and all other Political members of the government were to donate a portion of their pay to ‘help support the civil servants,’ we are still only looking at around 6.9 Billion Dollars savings (cost reductions) for the remainder of 2013. I don’t get the need to furlough unless all government agenices are furloughing.

Sorry I wrote this before checking it out. Soldiers do not get payed over time and we work it always. If I Die,
and what about the people that play games, without being shoot

You need to seek help.

I must agree with Jack, I am a GS-13 with both an engineering degree and law degree and don’t make over $100k. Plus I pay for health insurance and retirement. Haven’t had a raise in over 3 years and now must face the furlough. Civies aren’t paid the mountain of cash folks think, its the contractors who bill $150–200/hour who reap the benfits of defense spending gone awry. Ask me, I used to be one.

Totally correct. People need to google this. Civilian vs Contractor pay. It costs alot more to hire contractors than to have either civilians or military do something. Contractors, according to one university study cost as much as 100% MORE than government civilians. The average civilian is a GS5 through 7. Google that. $30,000-$60,000, is not millionaire pay. That pay is Obama type staff and other political appointees and congressional types, like the SES (Senior Executive Service). Contractors have to make a profit. The government servant and military member don’t. We don’t throw HUGE amounts of money into political coffers for lucritive government contracts either.

Maybe the real questions is to look at the world and think where the next danger is coming. Then decide what is needed for that defense. First we have to look at streamlining the DOD, reduce redundency. Second what type of weapons are we producing the JSF, LCS etc. Are they the most cost effective for doing the job. Third the personnel cost are part of the package you have for allow quality personnel. Try fixing a truck or tank without people forget people and you walk the path to mercs. Do we want to pay people who only loyalty is money. We have to also think outside the box, robotics, ships, planes etc. In the future imagine a navy on only a 10 ships running a robotic navy of hundreds, or 1,000 planes controling 10,000 drones, the technology is there to meet our need without putting more people in harms way. The DOD has to now make hard decisions and ones that not everyone will agree but it has to start soon.

Mike: Sorry to hear the VA hospital in your part of Virginia is not providing you will the proper care. I live in Iowa and the Iowa City VA medical Center and its supporting out-patient clinics offer EXCELLENT care. Some VA Medical Centers are better than others. Hopefully your care will improve!

No Bill, thats not it at all.

what about he gives up his political retirement or all of his pay on his dod pay? Talk about double dipping. Colt.45auto

Rarely is anyone in government is overpaid…except for those who don’t do their jobs. INCLUDING CONGRESS. I am an engineer with 25 yrs exp and I make (on average) 25%-30% less than my counterparts in industry. The problem isn’t the pay rates, it’s the number of people we have working. The government has so many regs and overseers, and it takes 10 approvals to buy a LaserJet Printer. It takes me 4–6 months to hire an electrician because of all the processing and “check points”. (I have an HR here on my base and we also have a Regional HR in Philly who process my personnel actions — WHY? I don’t need 2 HRs to hire an electrician!) We’ve got way too many checks in the system now — way more than the country can afford. Another example: I have an employee — his sole job is to buy things with a credit card. But his job has become so ecumbered and so hard he can’t process all the buys anymore. Which means now I have to look to hire another. Ridiculous. If we reduce the requirments — reduce from 10 check points down to 5 in our processes, we can eliminate the need for sooo many people.

This is a rather rosy account of the neglict and conservative thinking that dominated the US Army during the interwar period. Eisenhower’s own writings on the use of tanks during this period are far from visionary, betraying a conservative, institution-bound outlook. Consequently, we learned our lessons the hard way in WWII — on the battlefield itself.

So doing more with less, means sitting around and thinking grand thoughts in the event a war happens…who needs any money to do that…we could do completely away with the military and let academia think politically correct notions on how to deal with potential enemies! Thanks, but no thanks chuck…crawl back in that hole you came out of please.

I think the part people are missing in the aforementioned string is that these cuts are being mandated to cover the cost of the growing entitlements programs. Each year more and more people rely on the subsistence of the federal government. Your government is turning socialistic right in front of you, and if you are a working stiff you’re paying for it: wake up. Did you not hear that 47% of people do not pay taxes (this is not counting people under the age of 18). The sad fact is that your probably a federal employee and you voted for this administration: most likely not laughing now. Still don’t get it do you?

An excellent book that I recently discovered is Brian Linn’s “Echo of Battle: The Army’s Way of Way”, which covers the entire evolutionof US Army doctrine, training, and organization from early on (War of 1812 is the point of departure) up through 9/11. While heavily influenced by the travails of GWOT, Linn tells the story straight, and his handling of the Interwar period is as good as anything I have yet read. If I were to give the SecDef a crash reading program in military history, I’d also throw in Robert Citino’s ‘Blitzkrieg to Desert Storm: The Evolution of Operational Warfare” — lest he be tempted to trash talk about conventional forces and tactics in the now-traditional Bob Gates manner.

Although this maybe somewhat true, have you ever considered the time sacrafice and effort the military personnel put into their job. This is’nt a 9 to 5 job where you perform one task per your job description, most militar personnel have 1 specified job combined with multiple collateral task that regular civilian’s would balk and wine about when it come’s to pay rewards. This job require’s sometime 70 hour’s of work 7/365, and the sacrifice to be deployed and put into harm’s way with little pay rewards! No civilian or weapons systems can replace that! Yes, the number of personnel in some military braches can be cut and some of the jobs performed by civilian or contractor can or should not be replaced by service members, but do we really need to feed the War Machine’s Star War’s System’s in order to control cost also?

ther are many arguements on what needs to be done about the cutbacks, but simply put cut back the amount of civilians on the military payroll or dod payroll , put military members in there place, there are proably plenty of militiary members who will cross train, have soldiers do the maintenance on the bases, security instead of civilians, that alone would save millions, get civilians out of the military offices, put soldiers back in offices, let the military take care of its own business instead of GS civilians.

How about leaving personnel on station longer. Moving people assets around is expensive. There is a lot of room for belt tightening in the DOD. Also, there is a need to tell members of Congress NO to their pet projects for defense contractors in their home State.

There are men and woman who put their lives on the line, who leave their families for months at a time to serve the country. This goes for civilians as well. As a military spouse and GS employee go ahead as lessen my pay…with as much stress I feel through the deployments and not knowing if my husband is coming home or if I am going to get 30 minuets to speak with him meanwhile balancing raising children alone. Go ahead and pile on more stress…afterall we committ our lives and our childrens lives to the government we should get screwed by them right?! (note the sarcasm)

+Who is high payed? I am a civilian working for the navy. I make 60K a year. Last year I made 60K. The year before that I made 60K a year and next year I will be making the same 60K. I am one of the middle class Americans. Most of the federal work force make the same or less that I do. Most of the supervisors above me GS12 to GS 15 still do not make a 100K a year. Only the SES people in Washington DC, with a few scadered about the US make more that 100K a year. The are less that 10% of the civilian work force. SO joe GET YOUR FACTS STRAIT BEFORE YOU START MAKING STATEMENTS ABOUT ‘HIGH PAID CIVILIANS”.

Yep — we went into WWII totally unprepared. So I assume the Sec Def is advocating repeating that same mistake for whatever future war is waiting for us? Brilliant! Totally brilliant! Now I understand why our “brilliant” commander in chief selected him.…..

Both the North Vietnamese and Iraqi insurgents paid huge costs in human life. Is that what we are going to do? Throw servicemen’s bodies at problems? The American public will never stand for it and should not stand for it. In addition, the entire North Vietnamese economy was focused on the SEA conflict so I do not think that they did more for less.

I wasn’t there, but I remember my dad talking about how he had to train with wooden rifles because we were so unprepared for WWII… Yep, that was doing more with less all right! So is our brilliant Sec Def advocating that we should prepare to do battle with China, Iran, or N Korea using sticks and stones? Good thinking.… I feel much safer now.……

Hagel needs to read a book or 2. The services did less with less during that period leaving us completely unprepared to fight the Nazis and the Japanese. There were some excellent military doctrines developed during that period but without equipment and trained servicemen to execute them, they could do nothing to protect the U.S.. God save us from such insightful leadership.

I was born during WWII.That war ended then there was Korea.The Korean war ended then there was Vietnam.That war ended then there was Iraq.That war ended and now there is Afganistan.That war is winding down and now we will have another Korean war.War is built into our DNA.With the exception of WWII we did not have to fight any of the other wars,we just wanted to.You say what about the attack on the twin towers​.It came from and was supported by Saudia Arabia but we attack two other countries and don’t lay a glove on Saudia Arabia because they have something we want called oil.Follow the money ‚Lyndon Johnson and Dick Cheney sure did. Dead Marines and soldiers are just collateral damage if you make enough dollars​.In case you are wondering I am a Vietnam vet..

It blows my mind that anybody could think this is a good idea. Saying the Marines and Army are both ground forces so lets combine them into one role is as uninformed as saying F-22s and 747s are both airplanes so let’s combine them. You sure you’re not a politician? They’re usually the only people who put that little of thought into an idea before blurting it out.

We had many things going for us, but he’s not wrong about that 50:1 ratio. 49,000 M4s vs 1350 Tiger 1s. The numbers are even more severe when you include the other tanks we produced vs German production. If a US tank wasn’t too terribly damaged, it could be recovered and salvaged. Germany had little in the way of maintenance and transportation units so a Panzer kill became fiery statue.

All good points… But again with the 50:1 ratio… That’s Shermans of all types in all theaters vs Tigers specifically. Not a very meaningful figure.

That idea has been thrown around, but the Army couldn’t figure out how to keep someone in a single unit for longer than 3 years. Now that the war is all but over, they’re content going back to the way things were before the war. GEN Schoomaker tried to get the Army to keep troops at one assignment for 4–7 years. From a 2004 speech:

“Force stabilization. Today we move almost 290,000 people a year. Individual PCS moves. It costs us $1 billion per year. About 190,000 of those PCS moves are non-discretionary. In other words, they’re Soldiers who are entering the service or leaving the service, retiring, etc.. The balance, 90,000 plus moves, are discretionary. We actually have a choice on whether or not we move them. About 35 to 40 percent of those discretionary moves have to do with Korea.”

The DoD is working on that IT budget. Things happen slowly around here, but IT costs were the first thing on the President’s hit list for the entire federal workforce. I know my unit’s IT budget has been cut in half in the last year. As a whole, the Army is consolidating email servers and putting more services on the cloud. When the process is finished it’s supposed to save $75 million a year.

Exactly! I recall when the SecDef then Mr. Macnamara decided that we needed to ramp up the military workforce by putting civil servants in jobs that were formally done by soldiers/servicemembers. End results were soldiers/servicemembers who no longer had an opportunity to hone the skills of their PMOS and by far too many civil servants sitting on their duffs doing little if anything. Empower your soldiers with knowledge and dump the useless civil servants and contractors who are draining the taxpayers wallets!

I’d love to be able to sit down with Defense Secretary Hagel and show him what small business has been struggling with for decades.

Small defense contractors account for a large portion of our national defense manufacturing, but have the least representation in DC.„, and no, SBA isn’t much help

I know that this has less chance of a lotto ticket, but I would really like to have an opportunity to meet with our new Defense Secretary.

OK Sluppy Puppy you don’t know what the hell your talking about! I’m sick and tired about hearing how over paid we civial servans are. Here’s a dose of reality for you; I’m a structural engineer with the Navy, a GS12 step 10. I’m also an E6 resevest. When I go on orders my E6 take home pay is much greater than my civilain take home pay. My brother inlaw is an E7 (AWC), his take home pay is $1200 per month greater than mine with nothing but a HS education while I have a MS in Engineering. Remember this; we cical servants haven’t has a raise in 3 years.

We’ve got more oil than Saudi Arabia, but, the “treehuggers” and liberals won’t let us become independent!

Yes we downsized so bad that we had a very difficult time when war for us began.

LOL! I will give you points for persistence. TMB2’s number is ONLY Tiger I, there were another 492 Tiger IIs, so make it 1842 total and that counts a couple of prototype units. As for the Shermans, there were over 65k chassis built but only 49,976 fitted out as M4s, the rest being used as “gun carriages” and other combat support vehicles. Now consider that the Tigers had to be split between the eastern and western fronts. On the western front, the German medium tanks were just about even up against the British and US tanks, but the T-34s were shredding the lighter armed and armored German mediums, so… should the general staff send Tigers east or west. Lets just suppose (incorrectly) that they went for a 50–50 split. That gives me 920 Tigers vs probably around 45000 Shermans serving in the US, British and Free French armies. I will leave the long math to you! :-)

Tacitus, you do make my REAL point for me most eloquently! The cost of war can be measured as dollars or lives in a gruesome trade, but there is a huge “gray scale” between our approach today and the NVA approach in the 60s. Somehow I believe that there must be a common-sense breakpoint between bankrupting a country and the wholesale decimation of its population of young people on a battlefield.

Whine, whine, whine.

Do you have some sort of a point.…?

For any speeches, promotions, contract awards, or other information on DoD, go to http://​www​.defense​.gov. Click on “Today in DoD” and select, “Speeches.” There is also an alpha listing of all departments and agencies inside DoD and a lot of other information. Budgets, too, for those who want to see the funding plans and specific costs by year.

The point here is that NATO is completely incapable of defeating the Swiss, let alone the Russians.

Reforming the British military acquisition system is easy. When you’re small, just buy American. Let them do all the R&D and get a good deal on procurement unit costs.

Since we can’t afford our Tridents and attack subs, just give the Brits a few.

Obama is shrinking the ability of the US military to defend this Nation. Hagel is his new lap dog.

Real points:
(1) The US debt is SOOO big, any president would have to cut back on all government spending.
(2) The Pentagon budget is bloated. Postulate some REAL threats and prepare for those.
(3) Include cost-kill ratios into warfighting acquisition. How many combat aircraft (UAVs included), ground vehicles, ships, supplies, bases, does it take to kill one insurgent? Spending $100 billion a year to kill 1,000 insurgents? Really? Just pay them $10,000 each and they’d stop fighting. That’s what we finally did in Iraq.
(4) Shift one-third of the Active forces into the Guard and Reserves and train them three months a year so they’re ready. In other words, same combat capability, at about 84% of the current cost.
(5) Which frees up enough money to buy the best equipment (like more F-22s, now that the kinks are being worked out).

Part 2:
(6) Don’t spent billions on developing “new” systems; just upgrade the old at a reaonsable cost.
(7) If you decide what things to stop doing, or doing less of, and get rid of ALL personnel associated with those functions — military, civilians and contractors — them what they earn is immaterial.
(8) Honestly tackle the compensation of the professional military. The Founding Fathers authorized an Army and Navy in the Constitution and then refused to fund them. They didn’t want a professional military which would sustain perpetual war and bankrupt the country. So we need to be reasonable. Make retirements contributions into a 401 plan and make it portable. Eliminate work-for-20-and-collect-for-40 retirement packages.
(9) We need to get back into the direct health care business, but do it right. Paying premiums for poor care is unacceptable. And the VA is not the model. Look at Scandanavian countries.
(10) In other words, next year’s budget should NOT include any status quo budgets.

don’t forget the SA80 that they had to pay the germans to fix

They never learn, In WWII we lost battalions of soldiers in the armor branch, Ill trained troops, tanks were death traps, we went into all other conflicts ill prepared, They always turn away from their constitutional duties, To provide defense to the nation, all of the other departments, social programs(a states duties) they will not touch, Is it I the only one that see that defense is always cut rather than their vote buying projects.

We can always cut the benefits of people that face death on the battle fields they didn’t ask to serve in,but people that have not gave anything or Illegals keep theirs rolling.

It used to be the case that the Army needed to balance overseas and stateside tours. That will no longer be possible, so I really don’t see the downside of assigning people long term to a single regiment and/or duty station. Now that means some people get Fort Riley and Fort Hood, while others get Fort Carson and Fort Stewart. No free lunch there. When I was stationed in Germany, I did an extended tour, and a lot of my NCOs married local girls and just kept extending and extending and extending…

I’m a retired Army Vet (24+ years) that was fortunate to be offered a GS position in which I continue to do many of the things I did while active. I have worked as a GS for 8 years now, 32+ year total service. Not all civilians you speak of work in a 9 to 5 job that requires on focusing on one task per your job description. I work in a training-based job and conduct field training with my students every five weeks, eight times a year. My exercise is 3 weeks in duration and during that time I typically work 112 — 120 hours per week (16+ hours a day). Yes, I DID receive overtime at one time for those addtional hours, but that has been stopped due to the budget issues. I volunteered to work the additional hours without any compensation what-so-ever but was told that was illegal. I’m very passionate about my job and I am considered the SME and continuity piece for my module. Could my position be filled by a senior NCO or officier, probably. But at some point, that individual is going to PCS and then the continuity mentioned above is lost. D.O.L.

During the exercise I mentioned, I do not sleep in a heated or temperture controlled enviroment, do not eat three hots a day, and I’m required to live in the environmental conditions that my students are exposed to. I am required to purchase all the equipment and clothing required for my “comfort” during this exercise and buy my own rations. Other than pay, nothing I need to accomplish my mission is payed for by the federal government. I do not “whine” about this arrangement, It’s what I signed up for. Folks need to operate in channels 1 & 2 and get out of channels 3 & 4, so that they understand that all civilians do not fall into the category of taking up cubacle space and holding conversations at the coffee maker all day long.


Get this into your head. it is fundamentally wrong to screw those who serve this naton in uniform — or (as far as I am concerned, in civvies). I come from a family of teachers. The only thing I ever wanted to do was to work for the government. So I became a soldier, then I became a contractor. I actually passed the foreign service exam once, and the only reason I didn’t go do that is because I was separated from my wife and didn’t really want to be that far away from my children. It is a hard life, and everyone here who talks about their situation has made sacrifices to do what they do and be what they are. Use us, wear us out until there is nothing more left. But just don’t throw honorable and hard working people away like refuse. if you don’t like what this nation does in the world, okay, but if you do, show some honesty and respect for the work we do.

Got a source for that statistical claim?

Amen Brother!!! Why the heck can’t we go back to doing it for the most part without CONTRACTORS??? Get some facts up about what HIRING out the laundry costs… then go down the line from there. Who set up this system of contracting every little or big thing anyway? BTW, my husband is a contracting officer for the DoS. It is unbelievable… the American tax payer has been robbed… bilked…and no one will ever go to jail for the crime…

It is almost $1.5 billion EACH month, just to support the FIRST FAMILY… EACH MONTH.… $1.5 BILLION!!!


You are absolutely right… I wrote a poem today from the prospective of some of my close friends… Someone should ask those women how they are doing as they are rolling in all that money their families are being over compensated.…

Would I Be Willing

Would I be willing a second time to do it all over again,
Knowing what I know now, but I did not back then?

Would I be willing to place my hand over my heart in front of the bandstand,
Knowing what I do now of things commanders without honor can so carelessly demand?

Would I be willing to hear the questions of our children and to look into their eyes,
Knowing what I do now, just how would I answer the pleas and their cries?

Would I be willing to spend nights alone thinking of the threat the enemy would wield,
Knowing what I do now of how many would take their own lives after the battlefield?

Would I be willing to see him brought off the plane on the gurney,
Knowing what I do now, would I still agree to make that journey?

Would I be willing to hold back tears, and kiss him goodbye with a smile,
Knowing what I do now of the horrors of PTSD mile after mile?

Would I be willing to roll him again and again down the VA corridors,
Knowing what I do now about all it means to be a Wounded Warrior?

Would I be willing to hear the bugler play Taps, and to accept the folded flag in my hand,
Knowing what I do now of how this endeavor was lacking in a wise and committed plan?

Would I be willing a second time to do it all over again,
Knowing what I do now, but I did not back then?

So, do all of you financial wizards on how to save the American tax payer big dollars, which all these families are, want to put your pencil to exactly what kind of dollars service such as this should be remunerated at?

I had to stop at a local hospital today after I put my husband on a plane back to the Middle East after a little accident of slipping and falling in water. Most of the people waiting in the ER with children who might have had a little bit of a cold, (they could not have been very sick, they were all over the waiting room, rolling in the floor, climbing on the backs of chairs, and playing with the revolving door.… Their parents required a Spanish speaking interpreter to sign them in, and many could produce no “picture ID.” Not only is there a burden in providing this care in such an expensive setting, but the “English as a second language” schooling is very expensive as well… Some of my best friends are Hispanic, and they are incensed by our country’s seeming involuntary servitude as well to families who are in our country workng for cash, and not paying taxes.…

Wrong Amicus, pay checks already cut… or so ours says…

How about Stewart and Stevens, a little company in Texas that could.… heard of them? How about the MRAP, heard of that.… ? S and S purchased by BAE Systems, heard of them? English owned I believe… and they lost the MRAP contract while it was under their watch.… and boy are the details juicy…

And he can see exactly how it would be to his advantage to head up this little cost effective thing… just like the VA doing a $10 million dollar research project, and then when the results were going to significantly hinder their own budget, they “lost the results of that study somewhere, somehow, and can’t recall what the exact findings were at this time.…” But I’ve heard they are looking for them, and will get back to us as soon as that contracting firm they contracted with to find them, has them in hand.…

They don’t HAVE to make a profit.… they could do it for “selfless service, to serve their country…” We should look closely at what contractors report as their profit margins, and I use the term “report” lightly.…

That is a case of six of one, and a half dozen of another… except he is using the two things as contradictory.… Now that brings up the question for me.… just what did he figure the average IQ of his audience was for that speech.… Oh yeah, I forgot, he was just making that speech for the benefit of those desiring and hoping for a little star or two of their own … You know like using a pitch pipe to Q up the quartet for some good old harmony.… The previous little ditty was “family support and readiness… and what was that other word.… oh I remember.… “resilience”… I myself just feel resilient all over the place… I think it has something to do with wearing more “bling” accessories.…

I have a question.… or make that two.…are you in junior high, and do you play a lot of video games???? Is your favorite movie by any chance, The Matrix?

Rest assured that all will be just fine. After all, according to the liberals who are thrilled with hagel, we can rest easy, assured that nothing bad will befall the military because hagel was actually a sergeant during the Viet Nam conflict. That makes him eminently qualified to make the important global weapons systems and strategic decisions necessary in a 21st century world. All the sergeants I knew and know certainly are . How about you?

I guess I should clarify that I wasn’t taking a position on those facts, just providing data points for discussion from Aurora’s original comment about personnel costs.

All senior DOD civilian leaders should also be furloughed with the rest of us when it comes. If the Secretary is taking a hit.…they must too.….
14 days may not be enough.…I need to buy parts for the equipment we support everyday.

We have to prioritize what gets funded first, then second and third just like our family home budget. Look forward to it—–we have to adjust crazy spending trends from yesterday.

Hard is good—-Jeff

The new SecDef should be meeting with the gurus @ the Project on Government Oversight if he truly wants to get the Pentagon to enter the 21st Century when it comes to actually being able to accurately audit where the money goes.

Are you kidding? POGO is an extremely-leftist, George-Soros-funded anti-defense & anti-nuclear group. They don’t want to make the DOD more efficient; they just want to gut the US military, which has been precisely their goal ever since that group was founded in 1981. The vast majority of what POGO calls “waste” is actually crucial, needed weapon systems and force structure — the muscle, not fat, of the US military.

Amen, brother!

The Obama adminstrations plan is working like a charm.Use the debt crisis to disarm America.Sooner or later you have to come to grips with the fact Obama is anti-American.He never does anything to benefit the USA while doing everything possible to help Muslim countries.He is also stabbing Israel in the back every chance he gets.

Obviously you do not know what you are talking about when you say civilains get their increases and the military gets their measly pay raise. Fact: DOD civilians have not had a pay raise in three years and may not get one for the next 12 months while the military has consistantly received pay raises during the same time period. Your benefits package is a lot better for the military than civilians. For civilians everything we have gets paid for out of the measly check we receive every two weeks. We have to pay for Rent/Mortgage, water, sewer, electric, and so on and so on. The military gets their rent/mortgage paid for through BAH, live in the barracks free, get reduced meals at the galley and so on and so on. Try to pay for all that with the check you get and see what happens. Semper Fi !

Has anybody noticed that the Chinese and Russians are beefing up their military while we are tearing ours down? Hmmm, think they know something we don’t.…?

FINALLY, someone with big ones to tell the truth and what’s already on the minds of military professionals for some time. Good comment!

Well, Bush didn’t work out in those areas either. Unpaid for wars, lies, and basically war crimes.

What happened between WWI and WWII is the same as it has always been: the US decides to lower the amount of military personnel and equipment leaving us woefully short of being able to respond as needed. It’s the old idea of having a “Fortress America” in which we withdraw from the world some and collectively put our heads in the sand!

The US armed forces performance in the interwar period doesn’t seem to be an example of excellence that anyone would want to conciously choose to follow. We were mostly unprepared for WWII, espeically when you compare our weapons systems vs. the Germans or the British.

Going into 1939, the German AF had the Bf 109; the British had the Hurricane (and the Spitfire in 1940); and we had the P-39. Yikes — I think we lose on that one (continued in next comment).


(Continued from prior comment) In 1939, the German Army primarily had the Panzer I and II light tanks, only a few Panzer III’s; the British had the A9 and A10 Cruiser tanks; and we had … hardly any tanks at all — in pre-Pearl Harbour maneovers in 1941, we used trucks with the word “Tank” painted on the side! We lose round two.

In 1939, the German’s AF had the Stuka bomber, the Heikel 111 and the Dornier Do 17; the British had the Lancaster; and we had the B-17. Now this one isn’t so bad, in fact, we probably have won in the heavy bomber category, at least.

Obviously, a complete review of our armament in 1939 vs. our allies and opponents would occupy a book. But I think that a solid arguement could be made that we were unprepared for WWII, and that we mostly wasted the opportunity to re-arm during the inter war period.

So Secretary Hagel, think again on this one please.


Whole heartedly agree!!!!!

We were taken by surprise by Japan on Dec 7th because of the defense buget deing gutted by congress. Didn’t Pres. Washington warn us that “if we don’t remember the past we will make the same mistakes.“
we went into both Wars not being prepared and having outdated equipment also sending our troops undertrained into battle. Our aircraft were way behind what the Germans and Japannesse had, our intelligent of both country’s military was next to nothing. We thought that being seperated by two oceans we could be able to play catch up, well we lost several thousand troops ans aircrews because ot. Pretty Poor Planning leads to Poor Performance (PPPPP). Again in Viet Nam we did no intelligent and lost a lot of men . If in the late 40’s and early 50’s offered heilp to Ho Chi Minn to get the France out of SouthEast Asis, just maybe it would be a Demonocratic Government now and alot of Americans would be alive.

Well said, Bluto…well said.

It’s true History keeps repeating itself. As the cut backs after WWI got us into WWII. Honestly, on December 7th, 1941 our Military was ranked 17th in the World! Most of the Ships are Pearl Harbor were WWI Types! Go ahead compare the Bismarck with the USS Arizona! Also remember that the Germans lost WWI think about that.….….…Same thing happen at the end of WWII. We were the most powerful Military in the World. Yet, just 5 years later we weren’t at all prepared for Korea. Just think of all of the men and women we lost because of it!

All that said doesn’t mean we can’t spend better because we can. Yet, most want to blame in on the Military. When most comes down to Politics and from both Parties!

Yes, we used cars to simulate tanks, brooms to simulate machine guns, and logs to simulate artillery.

I think it was called “doing less, with nothing”.

NOTE: Comments are limited to 2500 characters and spaces.

By commenting on this topic you agree to the terms and conditions of our User Agreement

AdChoices | , and join us on Google+
© 2015 Military Advantage
A Monster Company.