Like Predecessors, Hagel Vows to Cut Military Fat

Like Predecessors, Hagel Vows to Cut Military Fat

The head of the U.S. Defense Department on Tuesday vowed to cut 20 percent of some areas of the military bureaucracy in a move estimated to save as much as $2 billion.

Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel made the announcement while speaking to troops during a trip to Naval Air Station Jacksonville, Fla.

Pentagon Press Secretary George Little in a statement e-mailed later in the day said the reductions would affect the Office of the Secretary of Defense, the Joint Staff and the Military Service Headquarters over a five-year period beginning in 2015. They will occur whether or not lawmakers agree on a plan to avoid automatic budget cuts known as sequestration, he said.

“These headquarters reductions should be pursued now, regardless of future fiscal circumstances,” Little said. “These cuts will be implemented even if Congress lifts sequester-level budget caps.”

Little didn’t specify how many personnel would be affected. The move may eliminate more than 4,000 jobs, according to an unofficial headcount of those areas. That’s less than one-fifth of 1 percent of the Pentagon’s 2.1 million active-duty troops and civilian employees.

What’s more, the Pentagon bureaucracy has only increased since 2010, when former Defense Secretary Bob Gates made a similar pledge, raising questions about whether Hagel — or any defense secretary — can succeed in thinning the ranks of the military’s top-brass and senior civilians.

The number of positions in the Office of the Secretary of Defense, the Joint Staff and the combatant commands increased 24 percent, to 21,952 in 2012 from 17,765 in 2010, according to a graphic accompanying a recent analysis by Marcus Weisgerber, a reporter for Defense News.

More than half of the overall increase came from the Joint Staff, which simply absorbed positions from Joint Forces Command after Gates ordered the latter to be shuttered in 2010, according to the analysis.

Hagel’s announcement is based on a strategic review of spending priorities in the wake of across-the-board budget reductions, Little said.

The Defense Department faces $500 billion in automatic cuts over the next decade. That’s in addition to almost $500 billion in defense reductions already included in 2011 deficit-reduction legislation. The first installment of the automatic cuts, totaling about $37 billion, began March 1 after lawmakers were unable to reach an alternative agreement on taxes and spending.

In response to the budget tightening, the Pentagon ordered some 750,000 civilian employees to take 11 days of mandatory unpaid leave, known as furloughs, by Sept. 30.

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Gates said he was going to cut 100 Flag officers from the DoD back in 2011. Did he get anywhere close or are we hearing the broken record play again?

I believe they’ve only cut 22 or so.

But actually, when you’re running a deficit, you start cutting NOW, not in FY 2015. The Pentagon doesn’t understand something as simple as SUNK COST or how to get back on track. Plus, the Pentagon bureaucracy is SO top heavy, they really need to cut 40%. That will not only get rid of the fat, it’ll shorten all the lines of communication up through the operational commands and the acquisition and maintenance commands that support them. For example, in an era of instant communcations straight from the Pentagon to field commands, the Navy has absolutely no need for two command ships.

Hey Taxpayer

I agree totally about the fat in all services, especially 0–7 and above (the brass) We have more general and admiral now than we did in WWII

But I disagree with you on the command ships, you should never have only a single thing of anything. If you have only a single command ship then its guaranteed that it’ll be 1/2 around the world when you need it

FYI those command ships are very old and well used. Getting rid of one won’t really save the budget


Having two of something is good for some things (like two engines in a Navy jet fighter), but bad for other things (like “managers”). The Navy especially trains its leaders for independence of action if necessary. So leaving the door open to ensure a chain-of-command just leads to bloat. As to the command ships, the whole idea of electronics modernization (comand and control) supporting situational awareness should now just be a suite of “miniaturized equipment terminals” (so to speak) on the operational ships. We need to compress this old school chain of command concept (which, BTW, supports the whole rationale for cutting admirals).

The Marines now how TWICE as many generals as in WW2, when they were TWICE as large!

As to “won’t really save the budget,” every cut contributes. And an accumulation of all those little cuts really adds up.

There are alternetives.​www​.djc2​.org/​i​n​f​o​/​D​J​C​2​-​R​e​v​i​s​e​d​.​pdf

I meant that there are alternative modular deployable means of providing C2 to an expeditionary strike group.

Here’s how we really save the DOD budget-in order of importance

1. Cut the F-35 program completely
2. Cut the number of generals and admirals and their staffs by 2/3
3. Cut 1/2 of civilian contractors, put the “work” back into the hands of soldier, sailors and marines so that they
actually learn how to maintain their own stuff
4. Cut Pentagon staff by 1/3 and have everyone else justify their jobs
5. Cut the diversity program completely
6. Get tough on defense contractors, fix costs contracts and massive penalties for non-compliance
7. Retire the B-52s they are obsolete
8. Cut the LCS program
9. Cut the Air force by 1/2, they don’t need that many people to maintain the number of aircraft they have
10. Last but not least reduce the army by a few brigades

Now on to the real budge buster, federal entitlements and medicare

Start at the top and work your way down.

Start with the so-called commander-in-chief.

After reading your post it makes it very clear you have never maintained any type of airframe. After serving for 20 years and now instructing new airman. I can say without a doubt that they need more people maintaining an aging fleet of aircraft. My last 3 years of service I performed duties as a production superintendent, normal day 13 hours. After the flying day, depending on how many sorties we put up that day, we normally were at 50 to 60 FMC rate, that meaning almost half the fleet of aircraft we had were broke. It has not gotten any better out there because the aircraft are just getting older. Oh and by the way the B-52 is not obsolete, it still remains the most reliable bomber platform we have.

how about cutting the politicians pay? Their the ones that got us into this mess to begin with!

I totally agree with that statement. They get paid way too much for the little that they do.

Dean, do you have any idea what you’re talking about? You’re saying “half of this, and two thirds of that” — do you have any kind of analysis to back that up? Air Force maintainers are an overworked bunch of people. Do you work in the Air Force personnel field to know how many people they need to keep their fleet in the air? How about the staff at the Pentagon? How do you figure the B-52 is obsolete? It’s one of the most versatile aircraft we’ve ever built and we’re still putting it to good use.

I’ll believe it when I see it.

Hagel was recently talking about uniformity and using more common equipment (we wear EIGHT different camo patterns and don’t even share boots or helmets). When he got asked about uniforms he started waffling. http://​www​.military​.com/​d​a​i​l​y​-​n​e​w​s​/​2​0​1​3​/​0​7​/​1​5​/​hag

Just more “show” and less “go”.

How about cutting the food stamp program. It costs $80B dollars to feed 104M people? How about cutting foreign aid to countries that hate us! How about the $2.2B Obama phone. The IRS who has proven it wastes $$$ on video.….How about cutting the aid to illegal immigrants! The welfare that is going to people too damn lazy to work because the government has stated it will support them. Scrap Obamacare…3/4 of small business owners will have to cut their employees time or release them and then it is even more people living off the government teet! These are just a few examples and I know there is trillions of fraud, waste & abuse located within them! You can’t nation build with a terrorist! You cut all that before you start with the United States military!

Just about any organization can use some cost cutting, DoD certainly qualifies. But it is at least one of the organizations in Govt. that is and has been authorized and is necessary to our country. Others, like the Dept. of Education should be cut for starters as well as two or three others, any like Dept. of Ed, whose metrics have gone south since inception, has no business being funded. Programs in the DoD like shifting combat unit from petroleum energy usage to bio-fuels which cost 300–400 per cent more expensive seems a quite obvious place to cut. Personnel on both sides, civilian and military who can be described as politically correct should be fired asap. They are of no use to a military organization that is charged with protecting our citizens and our freedom. It is rather obvious that some recent forced change of senior commands should be rescinded (those involving Benghazi) and those who relieved them of command formally investigated and prosecuted. The only part of the Military chain of command that presents a problem is the top three or four levels, and for our type of Govt. and military system, that creates the Greatest problem in a Free Society that Wants to Remain Free!

With DoD unable to conduct a new round of BRAC to shed infrastructure, real property, and associated staff, they have to figure out where to eliminate excess. Has any one ever looked at an Org chart up there. Its frightening on how many layers of management have been created. As one gent on military​.com mentioned as a former POGO member, they did several comparisons of troop strength to top brass and executives since the drawdown of WWII. The top brass and associated staffs ratio to troops on the ground has steadily increased. Attached is an article from 2011 addresses the issue. I wonder how many more have been added since then. http://​www​.pogo​.org/​o​u​r​-​w​o​r​k​/​t​e​s​t​i​m​o​n​y​/​2​0​1​1​/​n​s​-wd

Another example of someone who’s clueless throwing around recommended cuts with no thought as to how his cuts will be achieved and how they will impact mission capabilities. Do we need to make cuts? Sure we do, but not like this.

Go back to your arm chair and give some serious thought as to how utterly off-base you are.

Start with the White House vacation budget and then your head.

What company do you know of that pays their workers for being married or have dependents? Everyone should be paid the same on rank structure. Plus we need to go back to the old days when their were more workers and less bosses. We should have one military not four different military structures with over 200 Generals. Let NCO’s be NCO’s.

Regarding BRAC, before we do more of that, there needs to be a small change in the process. Evidently when bases are closed, someone forgot to put in the step that returns the unused land to its rightful owner, as a matter of course. An Air Force or other military installation was located on Choctaw tribal lands. The land was provided by the tribe during the world war II era at government request. When the installation was decommissioned during the Clinton administration, the tribe was extorted for significant funds by the Clinton Administration to regain their the land they had donated for use by the government in the war effort. Has This problem ever been resolved? And is the DoD the biggest problem in this regard or the GSA?

How many spouses or dependants have to deal with the contant stress of being married to a military member. Last time I checked if you wear a uniform you are on duty 24/7, which is 168 hours a week. I mean I would gladly take 128 hours of overtime a week and sacrifice my extra couple hundred dollars I get in BAH for having a wife and dependants. To add onto that how many companies make their employees work multiple shifts, go on deployments, TDYs, etc…

BTW, that military base was located just outside of Broken Bow, OK if anyone remembers it, let me know please.

we are building tanks in ohio that the Army does not want. Cut those programs out.

This is just a flat lie. This administration has completely stopped tank production, and closed down Lima. Happy now ?

The biggest problem, IMO, is that congress tells the military to cut its budget, but then balks when the plans the military comes up with hurts their constitutents.

The Air Force has floated a plan to move Combat Search and Rescue out of Air Combat Command and put it into Air Force Special Operations Command. The AF planners say it could save billions in the long term. But congressmen are saying it’s not “economically sound”. Is it any surprise that each of these opponents has a constituent who benefits financially from NOT moving CSAR within the Air Force?

Heard him speak in Charleston AFB where he outlined out a dim forcast for DoD budget and more personal sacrifice to come.

Understand once his sobering brief as over he and his immense security detail and support entourage move downtown for a night on the historic district.

hmmm, guess the BOQ was full? we don’t eat out anymore.

In response to M1 tank production, the US has not bought a new M1 in years. The M1 IP tanks were sent to the depot where they were stripped and rebuilt as M1A1’s. Just before the Iraq War the military was sending worn out M1A1 tanks back to depot where they were upgraded to M1A2’s. Just like the B-52 , the hull and turret were still in great shape. They just updated the guts. Saving millions from not having to build new hull and turrets.

In order to cut DOD the cuts must start in the Pentagon. Cut all these deputy assistants to the deputy assistant positions. Go through each department and prove justification for each job. Yes they are civilians. Yes making GS-11 pay. But DOD cuts the military ranks by tens of thousands. Almost 95% of which are enlisted. So what’s the difference between unemployed DOD civilians and unemployed enlisted? A savings of millions by cutting those DOD jobs that were useless and bureaucratical. Next go through military high staff and justify these E-7 and above jobs. Get rid of the Asshole Buddy System.

How about reducing seven eighths of your duplicate posts? :)

You must work for the Chinese.

Yeah, cut our way of defending our country from enemies on the outside but by all means build up the IRS so that they can keep an eye on us.

They’re paying to keep the plant open but not produce anything. Slight difference. We haven’t built a new tank in Lima since 1997. Everything since then has been upgrades and refurbs.

The problem of course is the government can’t really fire/lay off anyone. Their only real option is to wait for people to leave then not refill the position. Unfortunately the people who leave are never the people you want to rid of nor are they frequently in expendable positions. Cutting the government ends up being incredibly difficult because of this restriction.

Constitutionally there is an Army and a Navy. So, there should be at least two military structures. Arguably, the COCOMs and the staffs that support them are the ones that have grown the fattest over time. They all have different requirements and procedures which is contrary to “jointness”. Further, put SOCOM assets under the Services. Additionally, we really need to scale back and scrutinize the Security Cooperation funding, conferences, commerical training courses, and RDT&E budgets. Lots of fat there.

True to a degree but you have to remove the slot from the TDA/TOE so it’s not refilled.

It also eliminates the overall number of billets and hence impacts the promotion system which has to promote people based on how many are needed.

If someone REALLY wanted to make a difference have commands justify which staff officers are working outside their specific position on commander’s special task forces, pet projects or “CAG’s” (Commander’s Action Group).

If the staff officer is not important enough in his authorized position that he can be to assigned to a pet project maybe the HQ’s don’t need that slot to be filled?

This would drive commander’s to prioritize and justify these special projects which are often “busy work” for someone’s evaluation.

The military also selects programs that are going to be the most painful for politicians or even hurt defense in a strategy to avoid the cut. Look at sequestration. You can’t say there’s 10% waste in the military and instead training has to be cut.

Love the military but an attitude of frugality is long gone.

SOCOM is a success story. We would never have the assets and capabilities we have today if SOF was run by their parent branches. Look at Desert One or Grenada.

And why does the Navy need that blue camouflage uniform?

im not so sure about the last part cuz two is one and one is none nice too have a back up in war thing tend to get detroyed

I currently work in a TDA unit with a fair mix of DA Civilians. The ones hired as “Temps” were released with a pen stroke when sequestration hit. They got 2 weeks notice I think. That is built into the Temp hiring system. The “Perm” employees are harder to let go and to lay them off for budgetary reasons probably requires Congressional action due to various federal labor laws. You can eliminate their position and then release them, but that usually takes 2 years to make that change to the system.

Hagel should get rid of the many high-ranking officers that seem to have nothing to do but destroy their respspective services. Case in point — General McPeek. That Christian Dior wanna-be forced the worst military dress uniform on the Air Force. His other policies were focused on looking PC instead of building good espirit d’corps.

Those deputy assistants to the deputy assistant are not GS-11’s — they are part of the Senior Executive Service making between $120,000-$180,000/yr. Just saying.

Even better. Slash away!

I wonder if the bureaucratic density is responsible for high human costs *and* reduced decision-making efficiency.

Follow private sector and university lead and eliminate full-time/tenure positions. Part timers and adjunct are cheap, can be worked hard and fired on a whim.

Almost every “tough” job has the same issue. Surgeons and MD’s don’t get dispensations for being married or single…their families either explode or turn dysfunctional. Not sure if firefighters and cops have it the same.

…so that’s why we’re sending tanks to the Egyptians and the Iraqis?

Balancing the budget 1st, Cutting the President and Congress 25%, along with sending money to foreign countries, and get people off of President Obama, Socialism Welfare , oh by the way did you know over 30% of congress are millionaires how are they going to help the common man.

The tanks we sold to the Iraqis were probably sitting in long term storage. Of the M-1s we built for ourselves, we’re only still using half of them (if that). The last new tank was built for Saudi Arabia I think.

Depending on where in the DoD we’re talking about, many if not a majority of those civilians are former or retired military and not only bring significant experience with them but also institutional memory — especially in the non-warfighting units. We had a pretty thorough discussion on that subject in one of the furlough articles earlier this year.

We did.

That said, it’s also why the private sector can be in such a mess when it decides saving money is more important than experience. Royal Bank of Scotland had a serious IT meltdown because some guy botched a firmware update…from India. Suffice to say, customers in the UK could not access their money for days because someone thought IT was too expensive.

I wonder if it would even be worth rebuilding the M1’s; unless we have no expectation of the next-generation tank arriving in a timely, cost-effective fashion. We keep hitting our heads on ground combat vehicles. MBT-70 eventually turned into two decent tanks. I can only only hope that procurement ensures that a successor to the Abrams will arrive in a timely fashion.

Welfare states are expensive. The European nations demonstrate this. But gutting this country into a nation of Walmart, Target and McD part-time wage slaves serves nobody.

Yes, the Army and Navy are in the Constitution, but Congress completely distrusted them (a standing military bankrupts a country through blood and treasure) and didn’t fund them until the Indians on the Ohio western front killed off some white invaders (who were prohibited by treaty from entry) and George Washington had to form up the first real army unit, called the First American Legion. Got their b***s kicked, so George doubled their size, called them the Second American Legion and attacked again the following year. Same outcome, but worst defeat in US Army history. After that, the Army quit naming their units “American Legions.”

The woman who managed the DoD properties for about 6 years just went to work for the GSA managing their properties. Don’t know if it was ever resolved.

I see the M1 and the B-52 as two sides of the same coin. It is such a proven and sturdy design that we can probably keep upgrading it for years to come. Other than being way more fuel efficient, what do we want a tank to do that the Abrams can’t that would be worth the money?

First in 2014 furlough civilian employees 22 days to save real money.
Second cut the civilian workforce fat by 2015 there is plenty of it.
Stop paying civilians yearly merit increases especially since they have created wasteful spending for the past 20 years.
Cut all contractors and cut duplication by returning these jobs to the military. i.e. you have Military IT personnel and Civilian IT, contractor IT nothing but waste and duplication.
Get rid of the overstaffed overpaid civilian supervisors at all levels. You have to many supervisor positions that can be eliminated and taken up by lower level supervision

Thinking of poor St. Clair? And yes, we had an “Army” in the Constitution, but it was an ad hoc organization that would be formed as needed. Unfortunately, it turned out we really needed a standing army, especially to defend the frontiers from Britain, France, Spain, then Mexico, then the Indians.

I’ll agree on your first four proposals. The F-35’s 1 trillion dollar pricetag is preposterous. Especially in light of numerous Gen’s saying it’s not needed. Bolstering jobs is not a good reason for a defense project.

How about cutting subsidies to big oil first? Secondly, cut the F35 program. Cut those two first, than move on to lesser programs.

Why not cut all military tours in Europe to 15 Months, this could save Millions . This way no Dependents wold be in Harms way if there is a problem in the area. Also there would be no need for DODS schools in Europe this would save Millions also.

I’m a fan of units staying together for long tours because it means a better trained and cohesive unit. I have no idea how the units in Korea have gotten by with 12 month tours all this time. One of the ideas thrown around in the last decade was with the drawdown from Germany keeping a BCT set of equipment there and rotating troops for 6 months at a time from the States to be in the field or working with our new friends in Eastern Europe.

Surprised we’re still in Korea to begin with. If anything, we should commit to defend the Pusan pocket in case ROKA collapses. Maybe we can have artillery up by the DMZ to give ‘em hell, but let the South Koreans be their own speedbump. Keeping headquarters units and base housing up in where we project Kim Jong Un to roll through seems…crazy? And if we don’t project him to come by, then why the heck are we there again?

Bundle food aid with the farm subsidy. Pay farmers to grow crops and raise livestock, bundle the end product into CSA shares and ship *FOOD* to people. Appease two populations with one bill. The intent will be to theoretically deliver healthy food to the poorest people so they can grow healthier instead of sicker, which puts them back onto the dole for Medicaid. It will also simultaneously address the biggest grudge against giving people money: that you can’t control where money goes. Think a drug dealer will take a box of grapes for a vial? Doubt it. Which makes this system perfect!

(And by the way, this supports farmers nearest the urban areas, who face serious pressure to sell or to give up in the face of urban sprawl and modern civilization’s fetish for food from the Kwik Trip gas station.)

Then we can roll back agribusiness subsidies and ethanol subsidies.

trimming political fat could be a real fat burner

Ending political donor kickback companies like spacex, ( 60’s era slash down low launches–proposed 10 year plans with 300,000 doolar trips to mars, etc etc )—solar city, installing chinese solar panels on military bases slotted for closure, telsla motor car rich mans toy coal powered (green ???) electric plugins, costing american taxpayers billions that could be spent on hydrogen fuel cell energy for wheeled military vehicles.

The Idea military forces are more capable of selecting their own leadership, than a south side chicago male district pseudo lawyer might be an idea the FBI, CIA, ATF, TSA, could also use to be more effective in serving our nation with the fundemental idea of preservation of our nation, beginning with ” Independence “, acheived at greater qualities of life, when we used customs and duty to make importers pay the same accrued taxation domestic producers are forced to pay by the same lawmakers, who allow slave made goods to replace domestic made goods at relatively the same cost as profits are shared among members in the political arena and trading clan importers, who paid to enact free trade or globalization, words used to conceal the resurrection of slavery in america. gone our jobs engineering design-manufacturing comanies used to make all military equipment, while providing the free world with defense equipment to keep intolerant dangerous tyrannies at bay, not all gone but planned, like shuttle 2 a craft that if used as a bomber, capable of operating independent of earths magnetosphere, could place nuclear warheads anywhere on earth out of range from missles operating within the confines of our magnetosphere.

Personally I hope and pray for a better place in time, one where the political arena understand the idea of job description changes as information technology lead us to a point in time where data processing can be used to eliminate criminality among our leaders, while providing direction based on the actual variables, instead of the frailty of human opinion, now used to appoint the mini czars taking down old glory

The natural law of respect as opposed to predatory law used to hide and protect the world class mafia controlling our monetary system, trying to develop their one world power of oligopolies that supply the world with goods and services owned or controled by the MOB, currently trying desperately to dismantle the United States of America, in order to get at our nations pension funds—what kind of political arena do we actually have here and now in 2013 ???

start at the mouth beginning with the tongue used to recite the words used here then putting them into words i see points 1 thru 10, thinking without access to the variables like cyberspace hazards etc etc etc

The F-35 keeps us a few steps ahead of chinese technology copying the f-23, betty ended.

what about the same sex marriages and other phychiatric problems embedded into the laws of our christian nation ?

speak ? or read ? hearing the words coming out of his month is not the same as speaking, which requires actual thought, necessary to have access to variables about subject matter, a place where he cannot go. real education comes from interest. the ballot box no longer serves our nation as election frauds overwhelms our investigative resources—imagine, the reality some states allow voting without having to show proof of who you are.

a managerial study like the ones used in american industry, before the political arena, NYSE, federal reserve et al exported them into slave nations, that now provide us with goods and a lot of services, where it takes 3 of them to replace one of us, but they get 3,8 cents on the dollar, and live like dogs, mostly, ec=xcept for the MOB who take the cash living in secular communities away from common people, killing any political entity that threatens their grip on our monetary system

It serves the walton clan with near 100 billion a year, the tip of iceberg, where their suppliers take 10 fold plus before it arrives on american soil.

The MOB, their finger on america, the federal reserve, et al bribed free trade into power, it took our factories, jobs, more than 2 trillion a year in lost accrued taxation, stolen offshore by the trading clan without taxation.

the resurrection of fair customs and duty, making importers pay the same accrued taxation as american manufacturers would create the economic justification of american industry, and small business america, like it was before, when we had more jobs than people, and could be so once again, but, it would require the removal of criminality in government, taking back control of our money supply, and taking back the assets acquired by the MOB with stolen american tax revenue, wherever it is, without regard tointernational laws they enact to protect themselves, or act like china does regarding patent law.

Its not complex, information or data processing can easily identify the who what when and where of crime in government, fiscal policy is not a difficult task to audit . If you are allowed to do it. The offenders can create entire sets of creative accounting books for audit, but close observation can expose any lie. Its all about optical resolution. poor people crime is closely monitored, and quite creative for the lower rungs of nobility in our prisons of servitude. but it does not go into the realms of; legal, medical, financial, political, etc other than as a show, used to eliminate competitors of men of power, where really large gangs prey on common man, like the legal-medical-insurance fraud extortion mafia, or the pretense of control like the dodd-frank-act, which is self explanatory “act ”

You’re correct, he’s but a puppet on the lap of his master and taking the opportunity to blame Congress for lack of decision as if his master somehow plays no part in this fiasco.

1. We need a lighter tank, not necessarily in the main battle tank role.
2. We need a narrower tank, to negotiate roads and trails in less developed and mountainous nations, frequently encountered terrain in North Asia, Africa and Latin America.
3. We need a more deployable tank, that doesn’t max out the capacity of a C17.
4. We need a more sustainable tank, as you mentioned with greater fuel efficiency, but good maneuverability and speed.

The GCV chassis is not that tank,

If the tank is for cities/mountains/jungle, what would its weight class be and what would it do that the Stryker MGS doesn’t?

I’m good with 40 tons and under (Note the T-62 tank weighs 39 long tones). Using the C-17 carrying capacity 0f 84.5 tons, you do have some room to play with — but no more than 42.5 tons. It has to be able to do what tanks do, not just a glorified assault gun role. Note my previous debates with Maj Rod over whether the MGS is a serviceable tank destroyer (He said no, I said yes). Either way, We are talking about a technologically up-to-date system with no frills and does the basics right. The T-90 comes closest of any existing MBT, but you would need to shave off 5 tons somehow to get a minimally air deployable platform.

Broken record.

This is historically and factually inaccurate. The US Army was organized into four “legions” by Mad Anthony Wayne AFTER St. Clair’s defeat. Wayne’s legions, after completing their training camp near Pittsburg, went on to defeat the Indian tribes at the Battle of Fallen Timbers.

Sez here that General James Wilkinson, a duplicitous post-Revolutionary political figure in the pay of the Spanish government abolished the Legion mostly out of spite and jealousy against Mad Anthony’s successful generalship.

To clear things up, the “First American Regiment” was defeated under Harmar. St. Clair led the “Second American Regiment”, followed by Wayne forming the Legions.

No individual American should pay taxes. Since the federal government is here to serve big business and its interests, only corporate profits should be taxed. The federal government likes to manipulate the unemployment rate to between 5–6 percent, an average that prevents wages from rising too high for business and seems to be acceptable to the tax payer. So long as the fed manipulates unemployment numbers welfare and food stamps are necessary, but big business should pay the cost since this is again in their best interest. Bring it down to basics, Feudalism is alive and well with the castle on the hill replaced with corporate logs and the surfs tied to debt rather than the land.

Hagals a hamstrung political appointee who will never make cuts from the bureaucracy that supports and feeds him. Any cuts will come at the expense of the working class grunt on the ground.

Democracy seems like a bad joke anymore. Socialism anyone?

Eliminate the big service egos and do away with the many braches of the service, eliminating massive duplicate levels of bureaucracy not to mention 20 or so different uniforms etc and merge all branches of the military into one. The new Federal Military Service. That should save far far more than the 500 billion everyone is crying about. Find a less costly way to stoke your over inflated egos.


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