Iraq to Buy Hellfire Missiles, ScanEagle Drones

Iraq to Buy Hellfire Missiles, ScanEagle Drones

The U.S. is sending more missiles and unarmed drones to Iraq to help the government there fight an increasingly deadly insurgency.

The Shiite-led government of Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki has already received 75 AGM-114 Hellfire air-to-ground missiles made by Lockheed Martin Corp. and will soon get 10 ScanEagle reconnaissance drones made by Boeing Co.‘s Insitu unit, according to a Dec. 25 article in The New York Times by Michael Gordon and Eric Schmitt.

The missiles, which cost about $70,000 apiece, will be outfitted onto small Cessna-like turboprop planes and fired at militants using targeting information supplied by the C.I.A., according to the report. The drones, which cost about $100,000 apiece, are small, low-altitude craft that can be launched from a catapult.

The delivery comes amid rising violence in Iraq. On Christmas day alone, bombings killed more than two dozen people in mostly Christian areas of Baghdad. The attacks are believed to be the work of al Qaeda-linked Sunni extremists.

In October, Maliki visited President Barack Obama in Washington, D.C., to plead for more assistance in combating the insurgency. The trip came almost two years after the last American combat troops left Iraq.

Maliki, who rejected the idea of keeping more U.S. troops in the country after 2011, didn’t request an additional American military presence but presumably stressed the need for armed drones and AH-64 Apache attack helicopters.

The U.S. since 2005 has offered Iraq some $35 billion in weapons and services, though only about $8 billion of that involve deals implemented or approved by the U.S. government, according to research by William Hartung, an author and director at the Center for International Policy, a Washington, D.C.-based research organization.

Some of the high-profile sales include more traditional military weapons and equipment, such as 140 M1 Abrams tanks, 18 F-16 fighter jets (with a pending order for another 18 of the aircraft), six C-130 cargo planes, and other aircraft and combat vehicles, according to Hartung. The country has also requested a $2.4 billion integrated air defense system.

To combat the insurgency, the Obama administration has given Iraq a few Aerostats and reconnaissance helicopters, but a deal for Apaches stalled in the Senate, so Iraq has purchased some Mi-35 attack helicopters from Russia, and may eventually buy another two dozen of the Russian choppers, according to The New York Times.

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if I were IRAQ, I would pay the US to help them clean up the insurgency. For the US make a deal in return for buying US hardware, we can have basing rights in return and Iraq get’s top priority for gear & training.

Its the same as South Vietnam was in late 73/ Were pumping a up a filed government and arming it with weapons that do little to stop terrorist who do operations in densely populated urban areas with many civilians present. Unless the Shiite Government want to kill all the sunis off???/

I guess the withdrawl method doesn’t work…

This will not end poorly at all.

A bad idea to supply Iraq with these weapons. This decision just might come back to bite us in the future. Anyway, let’s hope that the new year is a better one than the last several.…

You want to get back into the most unpopular war ever? Yeah you sound like those idiots in the Bush administration. ‘Political advisors’. Like giving crayons to a monkey. This is all that’s possible, give them the best arms you can (without being too sophisticated) and help them fix the problem. Cessna’s with Hellfires, has to be the first time no? Like those propellor fixed wing craft with rockets in Vietnam. Sounds good, hope they can fix it. But 75 missiles sounds a bit low? Probably a first batch of a few to come. This by the way, will be what happens in Afghanistan after december 31st 2014. The US will pull out and give the Afghan government all the tools it can to disrupt terrorist groups. It’s the only option.

See my smart little friend, Vietnamese communists were NOT terrorists looking to disrupt a nation. Comparing Vietnam like you did with Iraq is so insane, death penalty needs to be carried out. First of, Vietnamese communists had the support of the Soviet Union (HUGE). The current terrorists only have a bit of money from Saudi radicals etc. Second, the communists OWNED the entire north, so it wasn’t like today with a central Iraqi government. Third, the communists had HUGE support from the ENTIRE population, minus a few minorities and US collaborators. Fourth, Vietnam was COMMUNIST, and didn’t trade with anybody, and CERTAINLY hadn’t any OIL to export. Iraq is being filled with tens of billions in foreign investment, mostly into the energy sector. When they can (with their huge land army) surpress the insurgency, all will be well. It’s just that there needs to be a solution to the sectarian problem. If anything, 20% (shia) will never regain control of Iraq which is Sunni dominated. It’s only pestering.

“Most unpopular war ever”? Really?

Well… That depends on who you ask.

According to the US NIE (National Intelligence Estimate — the combined opinions of all 16 US intelligence agencies), the war in Iraq:
– Played directly into Bin Laden’s hands, and gave Al Qaida (and the Taliban) tremendous numbers of new volunteers, and donations of funds and weapons. It also had the highly detrimental effect of pushing many fence-sitters (those ambivalent w/r/t the USA) to the side of the bad guys.
– Earned the US many millions of new enemies who viewed the US as invading Iraq solely for its oil (ironically — the Iraqi’s gave the biggest oil deals to the communist Chinese).
– The Iraqi campaign was tremendously unpopular in Europe (notable exception: England) and
elsewhere on the planet.
– Was viewed as the worst diplomatic/national security blunder in history.

So where in the US (especially with its citizens), the Viet Nam war was maybe more unpopular (the draft was in effect — so *everyone* was paying attention, as opposed to the 1% of the nation that volunteers for the US military today or has a family member serving), globally speaking — the war in Iraq might have been more unpopular.

Regardless of what you think of it or the motivations for invading Iraq, etc., it was a tremendously expensive undertaking ($2 Trillion spent so far — with a lot more to go), and we probably lost more than we gained (victories like this we can easily do without).

There is way too much to comment on in just a few lines, but: It is not like we have not given these people enough support, of various kinds, already, and don’t you think that maybe, just maybe they should start paying us back with all their oil !! We gave them 5 cent a gallon gas when we were paying $4.00, and for some unknown, unanswered reason built the worlds largest Embassy. This region has not had the true peace within itself since probably the Romans. So lets do what they and many other nations did after conquering a country and demand reparations for our costs, and get the h*** out and leave them in their normal happy state, war on each other.

Why does selling them these seem like a very bad idea that could very easily backfire…

Sure I’d give them the weapons on a weensy little quid pro quo. Complete control of their airspace so we can nix Iran’s shenanigans in Syria and Lebanon.

Yes, your kind loves all wars. This war is even worse than Vietnam. At least there was widespread support for the silly ‘domino’ theory, and you COULD argue communism threatened America. This war was cooked up on the back of a hanker chief. That’s pathetic. Like a group of 4 year olds making false reasons and excuses. Scream WMD on the top of your loungs (while you know they aren’t there) and you KNOW the whole world will find out in about 2 months after the invasion. They could have at LEAST made better excuses for going in. Vietnam only became unpopular after 60k gi’s died and millions were crushed for life. This one has been unpopular before it began. Only ingnorant c%unts ever supported it. You could have gotten anything you wanted from Saddam with a few little concessions and carrots. Even a regime change (letting one of his sons take over who were a bit more open to the West).

Probably lost more than you gained? The truth will make all Americans want to run to Crawford ranch and lynch the entire bush family. You gained NOTHING, and LOST a lot. The thing is, there is not ONE thing you’ve gained from this. See, the idiots in charge, thought they could get in AND secure supplies (oil) and gain a foothold in the middle east there. What they ‘miscalculated’ is the gigantic uprising, and the US of course NEEDED to end that and get SOME normalcy in Iraq. And the ONLY way that would EVER happen was by giving Shia control (remember the false puppets you DUMB redneck right wingers tried to install in 2003/2004/2005?) who were SPIT OUT by the Iraqi population? So to get Iraq stabilized, you basically had to give IRan it’s way. That means VERY anti-western oil contracts (Chinese were willing to pay anything, western oil firms wanted profits and didn’t go for it). So you spend 2 Trillion PLUS, and you gain a$nal wipping without the vaseline. That’s only describable as MASOCHISM. My god, I am actually all FOR expanding influence, new imperialism, but this dumb adventure was impossible from the beginning. You gained ZERO, only weakened yourself, and OPENED up iraq for China. Wow, that’s very altruistic. Of course ‘they’ thought it’d be over immediately, 20-30bn spent, and next stop Iran. If that isn’t the biggest case of ‘reality check’ the world has ever seen.

Why? Is Iraq armed with it’s ‘cessna’ gunships and all of 75 Hellfires going to declare war on the US? That’s probably the same amount of arms a single Aviation squadron of apache helicopters has. So not very much of an ‘adversary’. And I thought perhaps hellfire technology could go to Iran, but let’s be honest, the hellfire is very good, but it’s legacy tech. Not old, but not top-super-secret, US only tech like the f-22. So it’s a win win, you guys get paid, and they get to shoot sunni insurgents with them.

That embassy was built with the idiotic right wing dream of having it as a mega embassy for the entire region. As if Americans would be welcomed with open arms, and that embassy could serve as a ‘base’ for Iraq/Iran/Syria etc. Well, you’re not welcome. See, what the Bush ‘administration’ miscalculated is that in the 21st century, people are AWARE of their sovereignty. It’s not Algeria of the 50’s where you can easily quell an insurgency. Heck, it wasn’t even easy back then. We’d have to go back to the 1800’s for easy.

“Dumb redneck right wingers”? Are you just a typical leftist moron or are you the reincarnation of Oblat? Those ungrateful bastards owe us despite hating us. So when their country erupts into chaos again or somebody else decides to invade hopefully we can just sit back and send them a $2 sympathy card when they beg for help.

People including the President genuinely believed WMDs were there based on false intelligence. That isn’t a conspiracy that’s the documented history of what occurred in Washington. The guys in the intelligence community saying they didn’t have WMDs weren’t able to present their information due to BS agency politics and the like.

Of course it was believable with somebody like Saddam in charge who used chemical weapons in the past and had previously tried to go nuclear. Of course the White House and the politicians wanted this to be true because they had their reason to remove Saddam.

A few minorities and “US collaborators” who were mostly shot and burned or never heard from again. Such are the glories of Communism. Not that a self-righteous Europeans like yourself would give a damn about those poor guys.

People “aware” of their sovereignty? They were living under a mentally unstable dictator. Most people don’t even understand the concept of sovereignty! We could have quite easily “quelled the insurgency” the old fashioned way of burning towns and killing every male above the age of 12. Hell, we probably should have gone Roman and took as much of their wealth as we could when we left that hellhole.

What many forget is more then 90% of all Americans supported President Bush and the direction he was leading the country. Unfortunately, people tire over war. That is not the President’s problem. He followed the will of the nation. We as a nation must stand with our President especially when we direct his decision making. The fact that we didn’t is our problem, but most don’t blame us, just him. No President acts alone so blame all Americans. Then your argument won’t be so simple.

Owned? I thought they had to win a war against the French to “own” that part of Vietnam. And that was not 300 years ago. SF trained the viet-Congs to kick the japanese away and then they went against the them.

And following your logic, there is no terrorist, because all they do is logic. That’s like saying that the talibans are good guys who only want to preserve their cultures and their pacifist puppy field…

I don’t know on which planet you live as there is nothing black or white in this world; that’s why such idealistic world are to be found in fictive book; thus your overly simplistic vision of the reality –by being a selective part of the reality– is part of the latter.

And then suddenly those $300 rocket from the Hezbollah significantly improved as Iran mysteriously got something very similar in its arsenal.

First of all, this is NOT an insurgency. It’s a civil war fought between two fanatical sects of the same religion. All we did was train the two sides to increase the intensity of their middle ages religoius war. Who’s in power with the government is not important. They could flip positions and the opposing side would also be labeled insurgents.

We were stupid to invade, yes invade, Iraq. They had nothing to do with 9/11. Just the President Cheney Neocons looking to take controls of another country’s oil, which we really never needed (it goes to Europe, Japan and China). We are making more enemies around the world because we poke our noise into other people’s business. That’s why they attacked us. The US embassy in Iraq is just a hotel for American arms merchants. That’s America’s primary business — WAR.

Every single thing that is wrong in Iraq right now, and yes, the broader middle east, is DIRECT result of incompetent US wars. Meddling is fine, it’s been done and has to be done, but what fuc king idiot would go in and DISBAND a huge standing army that could have from day 1 quelled the insurgency or kept it at 10% of what it was. Instead, you made those millions of soldiers into out of job insurgents. Yes, that’s only a level of stupidity that right wing Americans like Bush and WolfoWITZ can achieve. No need in reading the dozens of insurgencies around the world before Iraq, he who doesn’t know history is doomed to repeat it. Iraq needn’t be invaded, any achievments the US wanted could have been done through carrot and stick. Now you have 5000 dead US boys, a stretched military, and NO money for replacement/modernization. That 2 trillion could have done an entire once over for every piece of military kit you have and then some. Tell me wise man, what has the US got to show for that STUPID war? ONE THING please. NAME ONE that you’ve achieved through spending 2 tn. I’ll wait.

Are you purposefully stupid or born that way? 90% NEVER supported Bush, and 90% NEVER supported the Iraq war. So why lie to me? Sure Americans got scared after 9/11, which isn’t difficult if the media keep making you afraid. Tell me again, why if YOU insult me, I have to knock your wife’s teeth out? Like when arab terrorists and al qaida which wasn’t even HEARD OF in Iraq, attacked the US, ‚you felt the URGE to attack Iraq? Might have as well attacked Poland, who had JUST as much to do with 9/11 as Iraq, that is to say NOTHING.

Hey smartyman, collaborators get killed, that’s what happens. You wouldn’t know that as the AGRESSOR. Wait and see what insurgent Americans do when their ‘fellow’ Americans join up with a foreign occupying nation. What do you think was done to NAZI collaborators in Europe after the Germans were defeated? Were they hailed as heroes? No they were killed or humiliated. That’s what happens when you collaborate. Iraq is different, since there is no small group of collaborators, the rightful owners of the country (shia) have been returned into power, instead of a small minority of Sunni who UNrightfully owned power for 80 years prior.

First of, the Taliban when they were in power before 2001, there was not ONE single poppy field left, they eradicated it all. Secondly, terrorist can surely entail FOREIGN fighters, like european muslims fighting in Syria, or Chechens in Iraq in the past, or in Afghanistan now. They have NO claim what so ever. Second, in Vietnam, why shouldn’t the communists fight France and even the US? It’s their country, whether they are communist, capitalist, socialist or even anarchist. So if the US were to be occupied (stupid example, but to drive it home), that means only republicans can fight against the invador? Or also libertarians? Perhaps even liberals? Why not? The saddest thing is I believe the cold war wasn’t at all necessary after that fool Stalin died, his successor was MUCH more pragmatic and much could have been achieved through working with him. But the special interest were too strong for that week bunch in Washington to stand up to. And to bring the point home in a most fitting manner, Ho Chi Minh and his new constitution and decleration of independence after ww2 was a straight copy out of the US decleration of ind. That’s how ‘freedom loving’ they were. And were treated with bombs and napalm for that tribute to your constitution. The french were openly imperialistic, you guys had this ‘domino theory’ worked out. Instead of blindly fighting ‘communism’, why didn’t we ignore that name and just opened them up like Nixon did China with Deng Xiaoping? Could have just traded with them and ignore their ‘brand’ of government. Like we do now, is Vietnam still an enemy? No. Are they still allegedly ‘communist’? Yes. Why go through all the trouble then?

I believe Iran can get hellfire-like tech from anybody. The Russians are among the best when it comes to missile tech, and I believe the Chinese also have that level of tech. It’s not a 21st century cruise missile like JASSM or something. It’s a hellfire man. No standard missile 6.

Ah, and here is where you prove of being 12 years old and mentally unstable. Killing every male over 12 Are you f-ing stupid? We should perhaps cap your parent’s ‘a sses’ for that one too for blessing the world with such idiotic offspring. Mass murder is what you’re advocating. I hope you don’t have health care and one day die on the street. That’s what you deserve. Babykiller.

This means of course that Iran will have a copy of each within a year or less.

This article should just say US giving Iraq weapons. Iraq realy isnt buying anything. We the US give them money monthly in-turn they use it with the use to by weapons from the US, and probably at a discounted rate then what we paid for them. So in the end of the deal US didnt make a profit, just another loss to make up down the road.

After reading your huge f__king lie regarding the Taliban and the poppy fields, I had to stop and wonder what a “Concerned European” was doing on this forum in the first place.….you have a totally twisted view on history.…particularly your view that the VC were not ‘terrorists’; they sure fit the description pretty good when I was there! Sneak off!

You mean give the Iraqis weapons fiannced from money we borrow from China that our grandkids will have to pay. The debt is so big, our grandkids will claims its not their debt and will just default, wiping out every military and federal civilian pension and social security. We need to STOP doing this.

Round and round it goes. Where it stops nobody knows!

Depends on what versions of these weapons we sell. I would only sell the dumbed down versions — strip out all the high tech toys that make such a difference for our troops but won’t mean much to the Iraqi troops. We should assume the “enemy” (whoever they may be) will eventually see anything and everything we send to Iraq. Anything we are uncomfortable with that level of disclosure on should not be sent to Iraq. That is why I would not send Apache attack helicopters, modern radios, computers (aside from the kind you can get at Best Buy) and Abrams tanks.

You misunderstand many things but the first and foremost is the reason that the US went into the Iraq war. We went there to fight the terrorist organizations on THEIR ground, not in the USA. And that strategy was a success — there were no major terrorist attacks in the US during the period that we were actively involved in the war. You obviously have forgotten that we went there after the 9/11 attack and the country was stunned by them.

If we hadn’t fought the war we would no doubt have seen umpteen domestic operations by Al Quaeda. Invading Iraq switched the terrorist focus over there. Now whether or not that was a correct strategy is of course debatable, but no-one, including you, knows how many civilian American deaths there may have been if we hadn’t invaded and fought them over there.

Never forget, there were over 3,000 innocent deaths at the Twin Towers. Our troops were fighting a valiant cause — to defend US civilians from domestic attack.


i wonder how long it will be before the terrorist have these to use against our troops in Afghanistan. The next question how much they will be sold for and who gets the money.
Frank Bowers; FIC; 100% DAV; Class of 1937; Austin, TX

Like the old lend lease the US used at the end of WWII. I typed many orders and put prices on them to reflect that they had been purchased from the US government, while rebuilding England, France, Germany and other countries in the 50’s it was always at a discounted rate. That way the officials of the country could pocket the difference and it was millions them/
Frank Bowers, FIC; 100% DAV; Class of 1937 ; Austin, TX

On a global level supporting Iraq is essential for the USA. We have to counter Iran in any way possible and whatever strengthens Iraq is bad for Iran.


S/S is not supposed to be linked to our US Government at least it is supposedly in a different account and not part of the treasury.

Perhaps I should have pointed out that many of these “US collaborators” were innocent people? Just unlucky enough to be sent to a “reeducation” camp in the middle of some malaria filled jungle to be never heard from again. Then the “intellectuals” are dealt with in the same manner. That was the “noble” North Vietnamese for you.

Hellfir missiles and drones to Iraq„,now that’s a well-thought out plan if I ever heard one. How bout a package deal which includes a few nukes? They’ve already been made popular in the Middle East by our “special relationship” buddy, Israel.

Whole reason for maintaining a strongman in fubared countries. Keeping order. Look at the congo now! The israelis wanted syria destabilized to keep hamas and the hiz boys on the back foot… same as iraq.

we abandoned RSV to an INVASION by a foreign power. An INVASION! not an insurgency. North Vietnam INVADED South Vietnam. It would be as if we ABANDONED south korea or west germany.

The same!

My friend, WHAT FING TERRORISTS in IRAQ? WTF are you nutjobs talking about? Are you all genuinely ignorant? Or just holding on to what you know is a lie, because otherwise all your sacrifices will have been in vain? I really want to know. There was not ONE terrorist in Iraq before you idiotic invasion which opened the gates to terrorists from all over the world. Iraq was peaceful and stable! Sure, Saddam was a psycho and was better gone, but not through this way. There was not ONE bombing, shooting, even KIDNAPPING during Saddam. Just like there are NONE in NORTH KOREA right now, same situation. That’s what Iron Fist means. Nothing happens what Saddam doesn’t like.
Anyway, you seem to have no logic. I said WTF does 9/11 have to do with Iraq, you don’t answer it, just link it to Iraq again. 9/11 were SAUDI terrorists, not Iraqi. Guess what, the same guys that did 9/11 are out in Iraq car– and suicide bombing the cr ap out of iraqi cities TODAY as we speak. After you’ve opened the welcome mats. Terrorist focus in the US? Are you insane? WTC was attacked once in 1993 and once in 2001, big DEAL. Beef up your intel and security, you don’t go out invading random countries like a blind rabid dog. Guess what buddy, you probably are a 2nd amendment freak also, that kills over THIRTY thousand americans yearly. 9/11 killed 3000 tops. Where is that logic?

My friend, as a lawyer, let me tell you even a petty THIEF can’t get convicted in LOW LEVEL COURT based on that FLIMSY, THIRD GRADE ‘INTEL’ that you had. Nonsense, the administration and it’s dark backers wanted into Iraq, one way or the other. Golf of Tonkin seemed like a very perfect casus belli next to this disgraceful ‘wmd’ hocus pocus. I genuinely believe many top level Bush administration officials should be hanged next to Saddam. You have to be dumber than a barn door to believe that they ‘believed’ the intel. War can be good, this wasn’t an example. It’s like a guy had 1 million dollars and spent 999.000 on candy and is left with 1000 in his pocket.

Vietnamese didn’t kill of intellectuals. If anything, the Vietnamese communists were one of the most peace loving communists (aside from kicking out the invading power of course). The KHMER ROUGE was indeed murderous and killed everybody, women children men, even for wearing glasses, because thats too intellectual. And guess who stepped in friend? VIETNAM. Vietnam and Cuba are probably the most peaceful communist countries there are. Sure they’re totally stupid and that way of governance is freaking silly, but they never means any outsider harm. (give or take the 1962 missile crisis).

And who put those south vietnamese into those ‘defense camps’? It was you guys. Taking them away from their ‘sacred grandparents grounds’. Funny, I read about that in high school for a history exam!

The taliban had eradicated ALL poppy production circa 2000. Go refresh upon your history my uneducated friend. And the VC sure had terrorist tactict, but hey, they weren’t chechens or saudi’s fighting there, they were VIETNAMESE fighting in their own country. And while they were guerilla, they wouldn’t blow up entire markets and schools filled with children. And even if they didn, which they didn’t, in war all is fair game. The Yugoslav and Russian partisans were also terrorists to the Germans. As were the Algerians to the French. Guess what, there is also legitimate rebellion. Not everybody can be branded as a ‘terrorist’, even if they wear beards.

Yeah nonsense, VIETNAM was VIETNAM. There wasn’t a north and south. The French created that false ‘line’. It’s like saying America isn’t invaded if the Chinese march in California, because Texas isn’t occupied. It’s silly. East Germany was occupied and directly in the Soviet sphere after ww2, apples and oranges. Vietnam was one country beforehand, the disgusting French just meddled too much and made a imaginary ‘line’ between north and south so they could ‘prop up’ their puppets in the south.

I believe these arms are SOLD to iraq, not given. Iraq is ‘flush’ with oil cash. It isn’t your little parasite ‘friend’ Israel, that needs money left and right. Like a billionaire in a wheelchair.

Hahahahaha. You have NO influence in Iraq. Iran does. Iraq is Iran’s mini me. And guess what? That’s what you guys achieved after spending 2 trillion? Heck of a deal right dummy? Rome fell long before it’s population reached the level of stupidity you guys have. It’s cry-worthy. I can’t for the live of me understand how the inevitable is being postponed. Probably has to do with nuclear weapons and a big navy. That entire Iraq war could have been spent at your home, giving you the best infrastructure in the world and health care etc. Instead you have not a little THING to show for it. At least the moonlanding guys brought back some pieces of lunar rock.

I would not discount the Cessnas with the Hellfires. They have proven very effective in Colombia fighting FARC insurgency. FARC is almost non-existent these days.

“Vietnamese communists were one of the most peace loving communists…”

What are you smoking?

One thing that I am aware that was eradicated was the right of women, like the right of education.

Where did your scool got their history book from. China? LOL

Not to mention shooting people for owning TVs. I’m thinking that makes the team for terrorist. How about dynamiting ancient archaeological sites because they don’t fit your interpretation of religion? These are also the same fellas that mutilate their women for daring to want to participate more or less in any fashion.

Abu Nidal and Abu Abbas were both in Baghdad, well know old school terrorists. Your assertion is false.

Zarqawi went to Iraq in Dec 2001 from Afghanistan to seek medical treatment and aligned himself with Ansar Al Islam, which was a Sunni terrorist org carrying out suicide bomb attacks against the Kurds from Hussein’s sphere of influence.

Zarqawi established AQ in Iraq through those contacts, seems pretty obvious to me AQ was looking for a new sugar daddy after they had been pushed out of Afghanistan. Pakistan was far from ideal as they knew the Pakis would give the CIA and SOCCOM plenty of quiet latitude to exterminate them in the tribal regions.

You mean our 51st state. Our unofficial 52nd state is Saudi Arabia.


I’m sure it’s effective against insurgents/terrorists as it should be. But somebody here made an assertion that it would be a threat against the US. I can hardly see the big US of A worry about 3 cessna’s with a few hellfires. But yes, against AQI it should be good and I hope they blast them away.

They fought their invadors, good for them. They didn’t systematically murder their OWN people like Pol Pot or Mao did. Or Stalin etc etc. Mass murder on the scale of millions we’re talking about. The Vietnamese never did that, they even WENT IN and prevented Pol Pot from murdering more people. That deserves kudos. That insane looney tune Pol Pot was murdering everybody left and right.

Sure, they are extremely fundamentalist and against women’s rights etc. Is THAT a justficitation to send thousands of young GI’s to a premature death? Or decades with horrible injuries and mental problems? To have a few AFGHANS go to school? F them. And that’s not even a reason, it’s what right wing pundits say to justify this folly. Anyway, F afghan and saudi etc girls. I don’t care about them. I don’t want my countrymen or yours dying there. Their religion is Islam, let THEM duke out the precise interpretation of their book. Heck, many American politicians even hate women, look at the republicans. Women are either token or cooking food, nothing more. So we got our own problems. Time to GTFO of that mediveval hell hole.

CE, I don’t know who you are but do you think for a second that we don’t know about the decline of Rome and it’s similarities to the decline of Britain and the US?

You’re obviously oblivious to this but your arrogance stands out like a sore thumb. Nobody likes a know it all. Try being a little more human in your messages and someone might listen to your points once in a while.


“Parasite friend Israel”, wow, no doubt now, between that comment and this one.…

“We love what we are. Socialist alledgedly. We have money, we live longer lives, happier lives and are TALLER (basic sign of wealth and health). We have a much bigger industrial GDP. Don’t make me into an anti american, but you have MUCH to learn. And the Us are showing baby steps in the right direction like the Obamacare thing. And don’t confuse Greeks with REAL Europeans like the Dutch/Germans/Scandinavians etc. So if you want to bash Greece, please join me, but that’s like me bashing Mississippi, highly UNrepresentative of the entire US.“

What are you concerned with European? That the Nazis were cast out a long time ago and there is no room for bigoted trash like you?

No. I choose the example of women because 40 years ago they were fighting to death for their liberties, 20 years later they were banned from school.

Their religion? It’s not the culprit it’s the men who practice it, just like us. Remember the crusades? I suppose that your history book show the Muslim as the invader?

Don’t get me wrong, I am not a feminist. I don’t even believe that they should be in the same classroom but I deeply believe to their right of a fair shoot, but that OT.

That said, we did went in Afghanistan because your sympathic Taliban in their great wisdom of peace were training terrorist. It was an AQ heaven that’s why. Perhaps we would have all been better served with a different approach but is that your opinion?

Iran just got a gift.

Who cares about Iran? We have 1000’s of nuclear weapons. It doesn’t matter if they get one. It isn’t even mutually assured destruction (which has worked for 60 years) — it is damage to us, destruction to them. What about our “friends” that Iran fights — Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Egypt and Jordan who produced OBL and AQ and continue to support them? I think Iran and the US have an interest in common — building a stable balance of power in the region.

Ho Chi Minh was OSS-assisted to fight Japan.

But instead of choosing self-determination, post-WW2 we chose to help European nations re-build their colonies and return to status quo antebellum. Many locals chose to fight for their freedom.

I still find it ironic that as a nation built from secession from Europe that we would choose to help European nations to re-establish colonial domination; but what’s done is done. And after a few decades, Algeria, Indonesia, India, Pakistan, East Pakistan, the nations of Africa break free of their colonizers.

After that, the NLF turns its sights on the French and their collaborators. And after the French leave, the Americans.

France lost Indochina, which was broken up into sub-countries. The intent was to hold free elections to decide by referendum who would take over, after an interim north and south Vietnam. Everyone was sure Minh would win, so the elections never got carried out. Populations did rearrange themselves (mostly Catholics leaving north Vietnam), but then the stage was set for war.

Just hire blackwater/Xe/Academi.

Erik Prince is in the Middle East this very moment, building his new private military company. Presumably he is training it to suppress Shia minority in Sunni gulf states, but for a price they’ll kill whoever you want them to.


The Social Security “trust fund” is managed by the US Treasury. The trust fund was created from payroll taxes (real money) taken of ouf everyone’s pay in excess of current needs. SS was created as a pay-as-you-go program. People paid SS taxes to support the people drawing out of SS.

In the early 1970’s actuaries noted that SS payroll taxes needed to be increased, with excess amounts put in a trust fund to augment payouts when the babyboomers starting drawing down. Good idea. But since the US government does not keep cash, it spent (borrowed) the real money on current social welfare programs and a bloated defense department. What’s left in the trust fund is IOUs. Now that more money is paid out for SS than collected, those IOUs are really just the Treasury printing money (checks), which normally would cause inflation.

Selling hellfires to irag! Tanks too! how long before they’re captured or bought on thne black market?

Some will be lost on their way to Iraq. LOL

When exactly did a Caravan become Cessna-Like?

Guest, you haven’t read the series of comments between Concerned European and myself, so you are misinterpreting my comment.


Great. Selling missiles to a country that hates our guts.

With that comment, there goes your argument. It never fails.

We need to help our military not create more issues. It is time to put GOD in the decision seat..

One of the Hellfires is on its way to Iran…via Fed Ex.

There does not seem to be any limitations on stupidity of the U.S. Congress.

Gee.…I could go on and on about who may end up with either those missiles or the ability to copy them but what is the point? Just as when the Republicans enforced America’s addiction to oil at and after the formation of OPEC leading to multiple wars “to protect our strategic interests” and our funding of both the terrorist attacks upon us and the Middle East’s armies with petrodollars, we’re going to be paying for another Republican action — the invasion of Iraq — for a long, long time.

Better, I guess, to hope that we already have an anti-missile system that has a 100% kill ratio against Hellfires…‘cuz if they’re only $70K apiece when we SELL ‘em, a nation that rigs their currency exchange rate — say, the PRC — could crank ‘em out at $10K or less a pop.

what a great idea! I’m sure none of these missles will ever be used against us like the ones we gave to the insurgents in Afghanistan to fight off the Russians.

Might! come back and bite us. Before the year is out.

Didn,t we just spend 10 years doing that? And what do have after 6000 of our people and God knows how many of theirs dead? We out now and should stay out.

Just give them the weapons with NO boots on the ground. BTW they could probably be less particular on who they blow away which is something we had to be so careful about.


That’s ok Guest. Very polite of you to say sorry! Shame that more on-line posters don’t have your manners.


A damm stupid idea people aint safe yet and the arms are rolling for $$$ theyll end up elsewhere and get used against our troops like we have exper. on scales.Stop this kind of war making fools..

Are we trying to make another Korea,lets just not sell them,wait until the whole police,neighborhood watch and army can be trusted not to be corrupt,or send ATF agents to make sure they are all used in a legal way.


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